Went back and played 16,17,18 and 19
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@gradekthebard said in Went back and played 16,17,18 and 19:
@halfbutt_psn said in
How about no new features but just balanced rewarding gameplay? That would be too much to ask, because apparently the devs know better than us what we want because of all that “data”.
Yeah, as you can see, my expectations are low.
The problem with your argument is saying “they know better than us”. Who exactly is “us”? The couple hundred people who post on this forum? The 5k or so that tune into their streams? Or perhaps the data they have from the 100k+ that actually play the game.
I am not saying that SDS shouldn’t improve gameplay, but they should improve it based on the data from ALL of their customers, not just the few of us that post in forums, etc.
I don’t disagree with you. My point is aimed more at the underlying paradigm that has revealed itself through the last few years of game releases.
I have no doubt whatsoever that SDS is making the game for the many and not the few. I suppose it is naive for me to hope for anything other than what the data says will keep the largest number of customers engaged and spending money.
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@a_perfectgame said in Went back and played 16,17,18 and 19:
@eatyum_psn said in Went back and played 16,17,18 and 19:
@a_perfectgame said in Went back and played 16,17,18 and 19:
@eatyum_psn said in Went back and played 16,17,18 and 19:
@a_perfectgame said in Went back and played 16,17,18 and 19:
@eatyum_psn said in Went back and played 16,17,18 and 19:
@a_perfectgame said in Went back and played 16,17,18 and 19:
@eatyum_psn said in Went back and played 16,17,18 and 19:
I actually think 19 is worse than 20 simply because foul balls were even worse than they are in 20.
I thought so too...but they aren’t. Whatsoever. They are still bad but 20 is worse. Go load it up you’ll see. I played a game today. You can get outs. Those low balls in the zone and balls in the dirt aren’t an automatic foul tip.
I don't believe they are worse, strikeouts are way up in 20 compared to 19, I never had a pitcher with a 9 K/9 in 2019, and almost all of my pitchers are in 20. Foul balls are still bad in 20, but they aren't worse then 19.
I would had agreed with you if I didn’t load up the game today and play it online. I went like 13-0 with most of the games ppl just quit in the 2nd inning but the games I did finish which was about 2. The pitching was absolutely better. What was annoying was the lineout or homerun meta — however people were def striking out because one they couldn’t check swing effectively and 2. That ball low in the zone was usually a strike and very hard to foul off. People did foul off balls inside and outside and above the zone but the low pitch that everyone chases online were all strikes.
I wasn’t a big fan of 19 even though I made WS a bunch but it was imo much more competitive then 20 in the sense that in 20 you can just swing at every pitch, check swing, and wait for a mistake.
Check swings in 19 and 20 are the same, SDS never made any improvements or disimprovements to them. They never touched that portion of the game between 19 and 20
You are basing your entire opinion on two games you finished? I played over 1000 games in 2019, foul balls were worse then. I know that as an absolute fact. Your one day of going back doesn't change my mind about that aspect of the gameplay.
Both games are bad when it comes to foul balls, so it's just saying one stink is better than the other, but 2019 was worse.
Like I said. They aren’t as bad. I also played the game that much. And before I played today I would had agreed with you. You are a year removed from it. Yes the foul balls are bad...but they are MUCH worse in 20.
in retrospect you are thinking they aren’t as bad because you remember them being terrible and they were. I promise you 20 was worse
So why have my pitchers strikeouts skyrocketed? I'm not just going off memory here, I am showing statistics behind my stance that 19 is worse.
Increased pitch speeds and outlier surely have a positive effect on strikeout numbers, but none of that would matter if everyone was just able to foul it off, but apparently, they aren't fouling it off as much because I have the strikeout numbers to prove it.
My Ks per 9 are about the same in both games. About 2 unlike 16 where I averaged 9.
Mine are drastically different. My highest in 19 was Gagne at 8.7 K/9, he was an outlier though, most stood around 6-7.8 in 2019 for me.
This year Billy Wagner is above 15 k/9, All my starters are between 9-10 K/9. Even Dennis Eckersley is above 9 K/9 (and he was around 6.2 in 19)
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@gradekthebard said in Went back and played 16,17,18 and 19:
@a_perfectgame said in Went back and played 16,17,18 and 19:
@gradekthebard said in Went back and played 16,17,18 and 19:
@halfbutt_psn said in
How about no new features but just balanced rewarding gameplay? That would be too much to ask, because apparently the devs know better than us what we want because of all that “data”.
Yeah, as you can see, my expectations are low.
The problem with your argument is saying “they know better than us”. Who exactly is “us”? The couple hundred people who post on this forum? The 5k or so that tune into their streams? Or perhaps the data they have from the 100k+ that actually play the game.
I am not saying that SDS shouldn’t improve gameplay, but they should improve it based on the data from ALL of their customers, not just the few of us that post in forums, etc.
They tried that that’s not what they should do. What they should do is just make a competitive game that has a learning curve and don’t cater to any player at all. The people that LEARN the game succeed the people that don’t learn — practice or do something else...play offline. The idea of just creating things in a video game in order for people to want to play it because of their pseudo-success is lame.
They already have that. And my guess is their data prove this out. Just because YOU don’t think the learning curve is steep enough doesn’t mean there isn’t one or that they aren’t being guided buy actual data.
The learning curve is trash. Scrubs compete. The meta of this game is swing at everything until you get a mistake. that’s not a learning curve. You can disagree you would be wrong or you don’t understand what a learning curve is. If you alter gameplay based on data. The game will never be good because you are shifting the gameplay in favor of the people that never learned it.
I’m sure you voted bernie sanders if you don’t understand this concept.
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@eatyum_psn said in Went back and played 16,17,18 and 19:
@a_perfectgame said in Went back and played 16,17,18 and 19:
@eatyum_psn said in Went back and played 16,17,18 and 19:
@a_perfectgame said in Went back and played 16,17,18 and 19:
@eatyum_psn said in Went back and played 16,17,18 and 19:
@a_perfectgame said in Went back and played 16,17,18 and 19:
@eatyum_psn said in Went back and played 16,17,18 and 19:
@a_perfectgame said in Went back and played 16,17,18 and 19:
@eatyum_psn said in Went back and played 16,17,18 and 19:
I actually think 19 is worse than 20 simply because foul balls were even worse than they are in 20.
I thought so too...but they aren’t. Whatsoever. They are still bad but 20 is worse. Go load it up you’ll see. I played a game today. You can get outs. Those low balls in the zone and balls in the dirt aren’t an automatic foul tip.
I don't believe they are worse, strikeouts are way up in 20 compared to 19, I never had a pitcher with a 9 K/9 in 2019, and almost all of my pitchers are in 20. Foul balls are still bad in 20, but they aren't worse then 19.
I would had agreed with you if I didn’t load up the game today and play it online. I went like 13-0 with most of the games ppl just quit in the 2nd inning but the games I did finish which was about 2. The pitching was absolutely better. What was annoying was the lineout or homerun meta — however people were def striking out because one they couldn’t check swing effectively and 2. That ball low in the zone was usually a strike and very hard to foul off. People did foul off balls inside and outside and above the zone but the low pitch that everyone chases online were all strikes.
I wasn’t a big fan of 19 even though I made WS a bunch but it was imo much more competitive then 20 in the sense that in 20 you can just swing at every pitch, check swing, and wait for a mistake.
Check swings in 19 and 20 are the same, SDS never made any improvements or disimprovements to them. They never touched that portion of the game between 19 and 20
You are basing your entire opinion on two games you finished? I played over 1000 games in 2019, foul balls were worse then. I know that as an absolute fact. Your one day of going back doesn't change my mind about that aspect of the gameplay.
Both games are bad when it comes to foul balls, so it's just saying one stink is better than the other, but 2019 was worse.
Like I said. They aren’t as bad. I also played the game that much. And before I played today I would had agreed with you. You are a year removed from it. Yes the foul balls are bad...but they are MUCH worse in 20.
in retrospect you are thinking they aren’t as bad because you remember them being terrible and they were. I promise you 20 was worse
So why have my pitchers strikeouts skyrocketed? I'm not just going off memory here, I am showing statistics behind my stance that 19 is worse.
Increased pitch speeds and outlier surely have a positive effect on strikeout numbers, but none of that would matter if everyone was just able to foul it off, but apparently, they aren't fouling it off as much because I have the strikeout numbers to prove it.
My Ks per 9 are about the same in both games. About 2 unlike 16 where I averaged 9.
Mine are drastically different. My highest in 19 was Gagne at 8.7 K/9.
This year Billy Wagner is above 15 k/9, All my starters are between 9-10 K/9. Even Dennis Eckersley is above 9 K/9 (and he was around 6.2 in 19)
It’s hard to judge by me because this is the first year I can barely get to 700. And that’s due to how casual the gameplay is on allstar. I would have to get to 769 to make a run because I never feel confident on allstar. The gameplay imo is just horrific up until HOF.
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@a_perfectgame said in Went back and played 16,17,18 and 19:
@gradekthebard said in Went back and played 16,17,18 and 19:
@a_perfectgame said in Went back and played 16,17,18 and 19:
@gradekthebard said in Went back and played 16,17,18 and 19:
@halfbutt_psn said in
How about no new features but just balanced rewarding gameplay? That would be too much to ask, because apparently the devs know better than us what we want because of all that “data”.
Yeah, as you can see, my expectations are low.
The problem with your argument is saying “they know better than us”. Who exactly is “us”? The couple hundred people who post on this forum? The 5k or so that tune into their streams? Or perhaps the data they have from the 100k+ that actually play the game.
I am not saying that SDS shouldn’t improve gameplay, but they should improve it based on the data from ALL of their customers, not just the few of us that post in forums, etc.
They tried that that’s not what they should do. What they should do is just make a competitive game that has a learning curve and don’t cater to any player at all. The people that LEARN the game succeed the people that don’t learn — practice or do something else...play offline. The idea of just creating things in a video game in order for people to want to play it because of their pseudo-success is lame.
They already have that. And my guess is their data prove this out. Just because YOU don’t think the learning curve is steep enough doesn’t mean there isn’t one or that they aren’t being guided buy actual data.
The learning curve is trash. Scrubs compete. The meta of this game is swing at everything until you get a mistake. that’s not a learning curve. You can disagree you would be wrong or you don’t understand what a learning curve is. If you alter gameplay based on data. The game will never be good because you are shifting the gameplay in favor of the people that never learned it.
I’m sure you voted bernie sanders if you don’t understand this concept.
I think something might be wrong with your game. I haven’t experienced this at all. My event win percentage has been consistent between 19 and 20 (65-70%) and I had no problem exploiting scrubs for all my prestige strikeouts. The median player in this game is pretty bad. And while randomly hanging pitches are annoying, bad players hang far more than good players.
Or perhaps the players you used to beat got better and you peaked. The vast majority of show players return year to year and it’s not like gameplay has changed in any significant way, so maybe they did learn while you stopped.
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@gradekthebard said in Went back and played 16,17,18 and 19:
@a_perfectgame said in Went back and played 16,17,18 and 19:
@gradekthebard said in Went back and played 16,17,18 and 19:
@a_perfectgame said in Went back and played 16,17,18 and 19:
@gradekthebard said in Went back and played 16,17,18 and 19:
@halfbutt_psn said in
How about no new features but just balanced rewarding gameplay? That would be too much to ask, because apparently the devs know better than us what we want because of all that “data”.
Yeah, as you can see, my expectations are low.
The problem with your argument is saying “they know better than us”. Who exactly is “us”? The couple hundred people who post on this forum? The 5k or so that tune into their streams? Or perhaps the data they have from the 100k+ that actually play the game.
I am not saying that SDS shouldn’t improve gameplay, but they should improve it based on the data from ALL of their customers, not just the few of us that post in forums, etc.
They tried that that’s not what they should do. What they should do is just make a competitive game that has a learning curve and don’t cater to any player at all. The people that LEARN the game succeed the people that don’t learn — practice or do something else...play offline. The idea of just creating things in a video game in order for people to want to play it because of their pseudo-success is lame.
They already have that. And my guess is their data prove this out. Just because YOU don’t think the learning curve is steep enough doesn’t mean there isn’t one or that they aren’t being guided buy actual data.
The learning curve is trash. Scrubs compete. The meta of this game is swing at everything until you get a mistake. that’s not a learning curve. You can disagree you would be wrong or you don’t understand what a learning curve is. If you alter gameplay based on data. The game will never be good because you are shifting the gameplay in favor of the people that never learned it.
I’m sure you voted bernie sanders if you don’t understand this concept.
I think something might be wrong with your game. I haven’t experienced this at all. My event win percentage has been consistent between 19 and 20 (65-70%) and I had no problem exploiting scrubs for all my prestige strikeouts. The median player in this game is pretty bad. And while randomly hanging pitches are annoying, bad players hang far more than good players.
Or perhaps the players you used to beat got better and you peaked. The vast majority of show players return year to year and it’s not like gameplay has changed in any significant way, so maybe they did learn while you stopped.
A guy I mercied in 21 beta just beat me. By flailing and getting mistakes - fouling off what he couldn’t read which was almost everything and got meatballs for Homeruns. While I lined out. And I know why... it’s because my pitchers are getting to 70 pitches in 4 innings because these dudes don’t strike out...they check swing and foul tip flail, check swing, foul tip. Sorry but that’s not skill. I didn’t have this problem in 21 as I beat very high level players and competed with very high level players. Who I don’t mind losing to. I don’t however like losing to some [censored] swinger because we give him the opportunity to succeed by not only allowing him to foul tip and check swing...but also force mistakes to him Down the middle which he is definitely going to swing at.
People didn’t surpass anyone in skill. The game was dumbed down so bad players can win
I’m glad the games life cycle is over. By far the most noob friendly mlb the show game in all of the years I’ve played.
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On a side note, wouldn’t all of this be theoretically better if matchmaking were better?
I mean, either lots of us think we are way better than our opponents but aren’t and matchmaking is fine, OR the game keeps matching players up with opponents nowhere near their level.
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ya'll think you're better than you really are
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Deleted. 10 char
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@drunk_wizard509 said in Went back and played 16,17,18 and 19:
20 has the most skill. Its because of covid that there are just so many people that put a lot of hours in that it created a lot of depth in the higher divisions. Covid really impacted the game this year imo
you are absolutely right - well said - i just pitched a perfect game in RS around a week ago - it was the mid 600's level - plenty of wizards in the game this year in 2020 you can really separate the quality levels even within AS but esp. HOF and Legend
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@thehungryhole said in Went back and played 16,17,18 and 19:
@drunk_wizard509 said in Went back and played 16,17,18 and 19:
20 has the most skill. Its because of covid that there are just so many people that put a lot of hours in that it created a lot of depth in the higher divisions. Covid really impacted the game this year imo
you are absolutely right - well said - i just pitched a perfect game in RS around a week ago - it was the mid 600's level - plenty of wizards in the game this year in 2020 you can really separate the quality levels even within AS but esp. HOF and Legend
Not even close...it’s the most unskill-based mlb ever. Even more then 18. And 18 was just bad in so many other ways.
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@a_perfectgame said in Went back and played 16,17,18 and 19:
@thehungryhole said in Went back and played 16,17,18 and 19:
@drunk_wizard509 said in Went back and played 16,17,18 and 19:
20 has the most skill. Its because of covid that there are just so many people that put a lot of hours in that it created a lot of depth in the higher divisions. Covid really impacted the game this year imo
you are absolutely right - well said - i just pitched a perfect game in RS around a week ago - it was the mid 600's level - plenty of wizards in the game this year in 2020 you can really separate the quality levels even within AS but esp. HOF and Legend
Not even close...it’s the most unskill-based mlb ever. Even more then 18. And 18 was just bad in so many other ways.
im not going to argue with you because you are simply a random voice on the internet - i am sorry you are so upset about the 2020 game, but that other guy was absolutely right and you are wrong - i cant believe you said 18 was better than 20 LOL what a joke
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@thehungryhole said in Went back and played 16,17,18 and 19:
@a_perfectgame said in Went back and played 16,17,18 and 19:
@thehungryhole said in Went back and played 16,17,18 and 19:
@drunk_wizard509 said in Went back and played 16,17,18 and 19:
20 has the most skill. Its because of covid that there are just so many people that put a lot of hours in that it created a lot of depth in the higher divisions. Covid really impacted the game this year imo
you are absolutely right - well said - i just pitched a perfect game in RS around a week ago - it was the mid 600's level - plenty of wizards in the game this year in 2020 you can really separate the quality levels even within AS but esp. HOF and Legend
Not even close...it’s the most unskill-based mlb ever. Even more then 18. And 18 was just bad in so many other ways.
im not going to argue with you because you are simply a random voice on the internet - i am sorry you are so upset about the 2020 game, but that other guy was absolutely right and you are wrong - i cant believe you said 18 was better than 20 LOL what a joke
Yea I’m def wrong about that. 18 is the worst game of all time. I got ahead of myself there.
But 19 I do feel like was better especially pitching. There is no doubt about it pitching was way better in 19. Unless you prefer to pick a spot with perfect timing and it go to a place it has no business going...like for example right down the middle. Because there is a good chance it might go there...hopefully not. Maybe it will just end up low enough for the guy who keeps dropping his pci to crush it. Depends where it feels like going.
But if it goes low enough...and it’s off speed to reach the dirt...don’t worry. Because his check swing skills will cover him. And if you are lucky enough to get it where you actually put it was way outside...on a 2-2 count...good thing for him. He didn’t recognize or care. Because he’s just swinging at every pitch. And he fouled that one off.
Rinse repeat until you are at 90 pitches by the third inning to get to a bullpen that really doesn’t have energy.
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@a_perfectgame said in Went back and played 16,17,18 and 19:
@drunk_wizard509 said in Went back and played 16,17,18 and 19:
People only dislike 20 because they aren't as good as they think they are
No people like 20 because it’s given them a false representation of how good they are.
19 is actually more skill based then 20 is. 21 I believe will be the best mlb game yet.
I base this not only on the beta but going back to playing the games.
You couldn’t spam check swings or foul everything off in 19. It was a thing but not like 20z. I actually didn’t realize this until I just played it. And the pitching was way more fluid. You could get outs.
Line outs weren’t even as annoying imo because rewarding bad contact was not as prominent
So you are saying I made World Series in 16, 17, 18, 19 and then in 20. All those bad players all of sudden got better then me. Or they were actually better then me the entire time?? Interesting.
Guys that I ran through up until championship??? That’s silly and makes no logical sense.
The only argument that might make sense is that 20 has a meta that doesn’t fit my play style. I’m way early on everything and feel like I’m hitting knuckleball speed and usually start doing well around 700 but it’s way more challenging due to the combination of 1. Lineouts 2. Rewarding bad contact 3. Check swinging to stay alive. 4. Foul tipping.
20 is not even close to the pinnacle of skill imo.
I agree but remember that last year beta and early weekend play was great, then on Monday that patched and it sucked.
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Too many people judge games based on if they’re able to get wins or not
️ -
I know i'm gonna regret saying this and probabally get slammed by every young person but i'm the type of person who tells it how it is.
The problem is not SDS. The problem is social media and the way today's society behaves. If you are a streamer or content creator with thousands watching you or even hundreds. Whether playing live or watching a recording and you find something wrong in game well all your viewers are seeing it too. It's like selling something and what is the best way to sell something? Word of mouth!!
Joe Blow post video how to make triple xp. How many people do you think are gonna watch it? And then someone watches it then tweets it and then gets re-tweeted and then put on facebook so on and so forth. Todays society you can't have anything nice because people don't have integrity and honestly don't know how to keep thier mouths shut!!
I hate to use this as an example but do you know why old fogies like me refer to the "good ol days of gaming." If something had to be figured out in a game you had to work to find out! Nowadays everything and every aspect of everthing gets put under a microscope and broken down and then it turns into 1 month old bread "Very stale"."
Anyway point is and tell your friends have some integrity! You find a flaw report it don't use it it is a very simple concept. But this is why we can't have nice things. And if i hurt your feeling b/c i talked bad about your life source of info well i really don't give a rat's @ss but for god sakes stop blaming SDS for everything.
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@grizzbear55_psn said in Went back and played 16,17,18 and 19:
I know i'm gonna regret saying this and probabally get slammed by every young person but i'm the type of person who tells it how it is.
The problem is not SDS. The problem is social media and the way today's society behaves. If you are a streamer or content creator with thousands watching you or even hundreds. Whether playing live or watching a recording and you find something wrong in game well all your viewers are seeing it too. It's like selling something and what is the best way to sell something? Word of mouth!!
Joe Blow post video how to make triple xp. How many people do you think are gonna watch it? And then someone watches it then tweets it and then gets re-tweeted and then put on facebook so on and so forth. Todays society you can't have anything nice because people don't have integrity and honestly don't know how to keep thier mouths shut!!
I hate to use this as an example but do you know why old fogies like me refer to the "good ol days of gaming." If something had to be figured out in a game you had to work to find out! Nowadays everything and every aspect of everthing gets put under a microscope and broken down and then it turns into 1 month old bread "Very stale"."
Anyway point is and tell your friends have some integrity! You find a flaw report it don't use it it is a very simple concept. But this is why we can't have nice things. And if i hurt your feeling b/c i talked bad about your life source of info well i really don't give a rat's @ss but for god sakes stop blaming SDS for everything.
Pretty sure the contra code was in Nintendo Power.
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@a_perfectgame said in Went back and played 16,17,18 and 19:
@thehungryhole said in Went back and played 16,17,18 and 19:
@a_perfectgame said in Went back and played 16,17,18 and 19:
@thehungryhole said in Went back and played 16,17,18 and 19:
@drunk_wizard509 said in Went back and played 16,17,18 and 19:
20 has the most skill. Its because of covid that there are just so many people that put a lot of hours in that it created a lot of depth in the higher divisions. Covid really impacted the game this year imo
you are absolutely right - well said - i just pitched a perfect game in RS around a week ago - it was the mid 600's level - plenty of wizards in the game this year in 2020 you can really separate the quality levels even within AS but esp. HOF and Legend
Not even close...it’s the most unskill-based mlb ever. Even more then 18. And 18 was just bad in so many other ways.
im not going to argue with you because you are simply a random voice on the internet - i am sorry you are so upset about the 2020 game, but that other guy was absolutely right and you are wrong - i cant believe you said 18 was better than 20 LOL what a joke
Yea I’m def wrong about that. 18 is the worst game of all time. I got ahead of myself there.
But 19 I do feel like was better especially pitching. There is no doubt about it pitching was way better in 19. Unless you prefer to pick a spot with perfect timing and it go to a place it has no business going...like for example right down the middle. Because there is a good chance it might go there...hopefully not. Maybe it will just end up low enough for the guy who keeps dropping his pci to crush it. Depends where it feels like going.
But if it goes low enough...and it’s off speed to reach the dirt...don’t worry. Because his check swing skills will cover him. And if you are lucky enough to get it where you actually put it was way outside...on a 2-2 count...good thing for him. He didn’t recognize or care. Because he’s just swinging at every pitch. And he fouled that one off.
Rinse repeat until you are at 90 pitches by the third inning to get to a bullpen that really doesn’t have energy.
no offence at all here mate but that sounds horrible for your pitching - i regularly rake in pitching, i am on meter - i did a perfect game with chris sale around 600's RS , on all star just a couple weeks ago (streamed), another game 16K's in 6 innings with kershaw, the list goes on and on - i have wade davis CP at 0.45 ERA after 30 games in RS - all screenshots and live stream videos to back it up..... - most of these stats are on AS mode !!!!
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@the_canuckler said in Went back and played 16,17,18 and 19:
Too many people judge games based on if they’re able to get wins or not
️absolutely mate, its this baby culture we have today of crying without putting the work in
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@thehungryhole said in Went back and played 16,17,18 and 19:
@the_canuckler said in Went back and played 16,17,18 and 19:
Too many people judge games based on if they’re able to get wins or not
️absolutely mate, its this baby culture we have today of crying without putting the work in
Lol, I put the work in. I’ve had success in mlb the show. I’m not a fan of the randomized game play. You guys are hell bent on not accepting that but it was talked about extensively in the last stream. “We wanted people to feel like their user input was rewarded...so we made it so the inputs are not random”
They also go on to saying head to head was mostly simulated.
Do you guys listen to streams or no?
Pitching is really bad in this game. On meter I hit PERFECT releases and get lobbed balls directly down the middle of the plate. This isn’t me “crying” that’s WHAT HAPPENS. They’ve completely admitted it. They changed the entire head to head game because of it... why are you guys ignoring this?
I didn’t experience these things in the beta...
