Kyle Seager
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@kovz88_psn said in Kyle Seager:
@halfbutt_PSN
Everyone else on the HR leaderboard minus Brandon Lowe has much better contact numbers. They definitely ignore plenty of deserving guys on the non big market teams but personally I don't believe Seager should be a gold unless he starts making more contact.Gallo is hitting .200. Is he also silver? I can’t remember. Duvall is hitting.226.
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@halfbutt_psn said in Kyle Seager:
@kovz88_psn said in Kyle Seager:
@halfbutt_PSN
Everyone else on the HR leaderboard minus Brandon Lowe has much better contact numbers. They definitely ignore plenty of deserving guys on the non big market teams but personally I don't believe Seager should be a gold unless he starts making more contact.Gallo is hitting .200. Is he also silver? I can’t remember. Duvall is hitting.226.
Seager has a 102 wRC+
He’s a league-average hitter, so silver is perfectly fine.
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.312 and 62 rbi with RISP. 88 rbi, on pace for 100. That is not average.
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@halfbutt_PSN
The difference being Gallo is a top level defender which boosts his overall. -
Home run number 33 and another 3 rbi, for a total of 91 rbi on the year. Hardly average, and anyone who has watched him would know Seager is hardly a defensive liability.
This one goes into the pool behind CF!
https://www.mlb.com/video/kyle-seager-homers-33-on-a-fly-ball-to-right-center-field-luis-torrens-sc -
Not a BR player, but I think he probably holds more value as a silver.
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@halfbutt_psn said in Kyle Seager:
I would argue the anti-Mariners bias is at play here.
Fans of about 20 to 25 teams thinks that SDS has a bias against their team.
Fangraphs has him listed at -1.2 offensive runs above replacement.
Brandon Lowe who has the same number of homeruns has a 19.3 rating
Max Muncy who has one less homerun has a rating of 34.3Based on that Seager is doing something really wrong. He only has a .288 on base average. He also has a -2.3 baserunning runs above average.
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You guys are funny. “I’ve never seen this guy play but fangraphs says...”
Can’t wait to come play your team so this mediocre player can make you scratch your head.
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@dolenz_psn said in Kyle Seager:
@halfbutt_psn said in Kyle Seager:
I would argue the anti-Mariners bias is at play here.
Fans of about 20 to 25 teams thinks that SDS has a bias against their team.
Fangraphs has him listed at -1.2 offensive runs above replacement.
Brandon Lowe who has the same number of homeruns has a 19.3 rating
Max Muncy who has one less homerun has a rating of 34.3Based on that Seager is doing something really wrong. He only has a .288 on base average. He also has a -2.3 baserunning runs above average.
I would argue that he has simply figured out his job is not to get on base but to drive in runs.
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@halfbutt_PSN
Noone is arguing the fact he's productive but RBIs does absolutely nothing for his in game attributes. Average, power, fielding do. He is really good at 1 of the 3. He is a silver -
@halfbutt_psn said in Kyle Seager:
@dolenz_psn said in Kyle Seager:
@halfbutt_psn said in Kyle Seager:
I would argue the anti-Mariners bias is at play here.
Fans of about 20 to 25 teams thinks that SDS has a bias against their team.
Fangraphs has him listed at -1.2 offensive runs above replacement.
Brandon Lowe who has the same number of homeruns has a 19.3 rating
Max Muncy who has one less homerun has a rating of 34.3Based on that Seager is doing something really wrong. He only has a .288 on base average. He also has a -2.3 baserunning runs above average.
I would argue that he has simply figured out his job is not to get on base but to drive in runs.
He should figure out how to be better than a league-average hitter instead.
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@kovz88_psn said in Kyle Seager:
@halfbutt_PSN
Noone is arguing the fact he's productive but RBIs does absolutely nothing for his in game attributes. Average, power, fielding do. He is really good at 1 of the 3. He is a silverGood points. How much would the power attribute and/or defensive attributes need to go up make him an 80 OVR?
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@jogger171717_psn said in Kyle Seager:
@halfbutt_psn said in Kyle Seager:
@dolenz_psn said in Kyle Seager:
@halfbutt_psn said in Kyle Seager:
I would argue the anti-Mariners bias is at play here.
Fans of about 20 to 25 teams thinks that SDS has a bias against their team.
Fangraphs has him listed at -1.2 offensive runs above replacement.
Brandon Lowe who has the same number of homeruns has a 19.3 rating
Max Muncy who has one less homerun has a rating of 34.3Based on that Seager is doing something really wrong. He only has a .288 on base average. He also has a -2.3 baserunning runs above average.
I would argue that he has simply figured out his job is not to get on base but to drive in runs.
He should figure out how to be better than a league-average hitter instead.
I’ll take the .312 and 72 rbi with RISP over the “league average”.
Having a 3 hitter that gets the job done, to me, is worth more. I guess technically that would be clutch attribute?
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@halfbutt_PSN
That one I can't really answer. I would guess with that contact he's gonna need to be 100+ power and close to diamond defense -
@halfbutt_psn said in Kyle Seager:
@jogger171717_psn said in Kyle Seager:
@halfbutt_psn said in Kyle Seager:
@dolenz_psn said in Kyle Seager:
@halfbutt_psn said in Kyle Seager:
I would argue the anti-Mariners bias is at play here.
Fans of about 20 to 25 teams thinks that SDS has a bias against their team.
Fangraphs has him listed at -1.2 offensive runs above replacement.
Brandon Lowe who has the same number of homeruns has a 19.3 rating
Max Muncy who has one less homerun has a rating of 34.3Based on that Seager is doing something really wrong. He only has a .288 on base average. He also has a -2.3 baserunning runs above average.
I would argue that he has simply figured out his job is not to get on base but to drive in runs.
He should figure out how to be better than a league-average hitter instead.
I’ll take the .312 and 72 rbi with RISP over the “league average”.
Having a 3 hitter that gets the job done, to me, is worth more. I guess technically that would be clutch attribute?
So you’d take a worse hitter that just has a decent amount of RBIs (a highly team-dependent stat) over an actually good hitter?
Some incredibly backwards logic going on here
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@jogger171717_psn said in Kyle Seager:
@halfbutt_psn said in Kyle Seager:
@jogger171717_psn said in Kyle Seager:
@halfbutt_psn said in Kyle Seager:
@dolenz_psn said in Kyle Seager:
@halfbutt_psn said in Kyle Seager:
I would argue the anti-Mariners bias is at play here.
Fans of about 20 to 25 teams thinks that SDS has a bias against their team.
Fangraphs has him listed at -1.2 offensive runs above replacement.
Brandon Lowe who has the same number of homeruns has a 19.3 rating
Max Muncy who has one less homerun has a rating of 34.3Based on that Seager is doing something really wrong. He only has a .288 on base average. He also has a -2.3 baserunning runs above average.
I would argue that he has simply figured out his job is not to get on base but to drive in runs.
He should figure out how to be better than a league-average hitter instead.
I’ll take the .312 and 72 rbi with RISP over the “league average”.
Having a 3 hitter that gets the job done, to me, is worth more. I guess technically that would be clutch attribute?
So you’d take a worse hitter that just has a decent amount of RBIs (a highly team-dependent stat) over an actually good hitter?
Some incredibly backwards logic going on here
The only backwards logic is arguing that a guy hitting .312 with RISP, 91 rbi on Sept 4th, and sixth in baseball with 33 bombs is not a good hitter.
Kovz is making informed, objective points. You sir, I’m not sure what your agenda is, other than to chirp.
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@halfbutt_psn said in Kyle Seager:
@jogger171717_psn said in Kyle Seager:
@halfbutt_psn said in Kyle Seager:
@jogger171717_psn said in Kyle Seager:
@halfbutt_psn said in Kyle Seager:
@dolenz_psn said in Kyle Seager:
@halfbutt_psn said in Kyle Seager:
I would argue the anti-Mariners bias is at play here.
Fans of about 20 to 25 teams thinks that SDS has a bias against their team.
Fangraphs has him listed at -1.2 offensive runs above replacement.
Brandon Lowe who has the same number of homeruns has a 19.3 rating
Max Muncy who has one less homerun has a rating of 34.3Based on that Seager is doing something really wrong. He only has a .288 on base average. He also has a -2.3 baserunning runs above average.
I would argue that he has simply figured out his job is not to get on base but to drive in runs.
He should figure out how to be better than a league-average hitter instead.
I’ll take the .312 and 72 rbi with RISP over the “league average”.
Having a 3 hitter that gets the job done, to me, is worth more. I guess technically that would be clutch attribute?
So you’d take a worse hitter that just has a decent amount of RBIs (a highly team-dependent stat) over an actually good hitter?
Some incredibly backwards logic going on here
The only backwards logic is arguing that a guy hitting .312 with RISP, 91 rbi on Sept 4th, and sixth in baseball with 33 bombs is not a good hitter.
Kovz is making informed, objective points. You sir, I’m not sure what your agenda is, other than to chirp.
I gave you a stat that literally proves he’s been a league-average hitter this season, which justifies him being a silver. You’re using things that don’t matter, like rbi and avg with risp. Having 33 home runs doesn’t mean he’s been a good hitter.
In 2018, Joey Gallo was 3rd in HR with 40, but only had a 108 wRC+. The rest of the top 10 all had basically 130 wRC+ or higher, Martinez and trout even having 170 and 188 respectively. The point is that hitting a bunch of HR doesn’t mean much if that’s the only thing you can do.
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I think Scott Servais would beg to differ.
91 rbi and .312 with RISP don’t matter? Maybe not to sabremetricians, but anyone with a brain can see that the Mariners won tonight because Seager hit two bombs and drove in six runs.
Who cares if he is hitting .214? They won the game and kept pace in the standings.
This, imo, is the problem with modern metrics.
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@halfbutt_psn said in Kyle Seager:
I’ll take the .312 and 72 rbi with RISP over the “league average”.
Fangraphs has him at .310 with 59 RBIs when runners are in scoring position. Still very good.
But as others have said. RBIs don't help any attribute. Average with runners in scoring might help the clutch rating but Kyle already has a 95 clutch rating so it will be hard for them to raise that.
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6 rbi tonight, 12 since the 22nd August. Maybe fangraphs has yet to update.
You make a good point. If his clutch is 95, that attribute wouldn’t get him past 79.
I think maybe there is something lacking in the way the attributes convert to OVR.
I was thinking, for example, Ketel Marte has 10 home runs, 49 rbi on the year. He’s hitting a solid .337 (albeit in half as many at bats as Seags) and is a LS diamond.
To me, this doesn’t add up.
