Very interesting Bonds and Clemens article
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Well he hit the most home runs so it sounds like he should to me. Haha I get your point but I do not agree
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@gradekthebard said in Very interesting Bonds and Clemens article:
@jogger171717_psn said in Very interesting Bonds and Clemens article:
So the article pretty much shows exactly what I’ve always said, that both Bonds and Clemens had HoF careers even without the steroids.
And Pete Rose had a HoF career without the gambling, Joe Jackson without the Black Sox, and Mattingly without the back problems. Guess what, neither Bonds nor Clemens are getting in and I’d go,further to say the veterans committee let’s in McGwire before them too.
Good thing you don’t have a say in it, because both bonds and Clemens are 100% going to get in eventually, even if it is via the veterans committee.
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In the end I don't care much one way or the other, but once you let Bond or Clemens in then you have to open the door to the possibility of letting all of the other worthy players who were either guilty or suspected of steroid use. Once they vote one of them in then things are going to get messy.
I am also of the opinion that if you used any type of enhancing drug before it was against the rules then their should be more leeway than if you used enhancers after they were specially listed as banned.
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@ustoopid2_psn said in Very interesting Bonds and Clemens article:
@poksey_mlbts said in Very interesting Bonds and Clemens article:
@ustoopid2_psn said in Very interesting Bonds and Clemens article:
@poksey_mlbts said in Very interesting Bonds and Clemens article:
We all know the main names that are in the Mitchell report, and those most suspected of PEDs. It still doesnt make sense to me that they have been blackballed while others have been inducted. Biggio, Bagwell, Pudge, Piazza. They have known and admitted amphetamine users in, as well as known and admitted cocaine users.
At this point its strictly being vindictive against certain players, while turning a blind eye towards others.
Cocaine and Speed doesn't cause your head to grow 3x larger among other body enhancements and they definitely dont turn back the clock on father time making you better at 39-40 than you were at 29-30. GTFOH
But they are illegal by the rules. They certainly have benefits, which is why people use them. It's still cheating, or knowingly breaking the rules to gain an advantage. There is obviously a difference in advantage given between substances, but the fact remains that it's still cheating.
They aren't using cocaine to play baseball better, they do cocaine to get high. People use steroids to play sports better hence why they are called Performance Enhancing Drugs. Cocaine isnt classified as a PED.
Raines kept a vial in his pocket that he would hit when he needed a pick up. You're telling me that players didnt think it helped them on the field? What about amphetamines? Many players including some all time greats like Mays, Aaron and Schmidt have admitted to taking them for the perks they gave them.
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@poksey_mlbts said in Very interesting Bonds and Clemens article:
@ustoopid2_psn said in Very interesting Bonds and Clemens article:
@poksey_mlbts said in Very interesting Bonds and Clemens article:
@ustoopid2_psn said in Very interesting Bonds and Clemens article:
@poksey_mlbts said in Very interesting Bonds and Clemens article:
We all know the main names that are in the Mitchell report, and those most suspected of PEDs. It still doesnt make sense to me that they have been blackballed while others have been inducted. Biggio, Bagwell, Pudge, Piazza. They have known and admitted amphetamine users in, as well as known and admitted cocaine users.
At this point its strictly being vindictive against certain players, while turning a blind eye towards others.
Cocaine and Speed doesn't cause your head to grow 3x larger among other body enhancements and they definitely dont turn back the clock on father time making you better at 39-40 than you were at 29-30. GTFOH
But they are illegal by the rules. They certainly have benefits, which is why people use them. It's still cheating, or knowingly breaking the rules to gain an advantage. There is obviously a difference in advantage given between substances, but the fact remains that it's still cheating.
They aren't using cocaine to play baseball better, they do cocaine to get high. People use steroids to play sports better hence why they are called Performance Enhancing Drugs. Cocaine isnt classified as a PED.
Raines kept a vial in his pocket that he would hit when he needed a pick up. You're telling me that players didnt think it helped them on the field? What about amphetamines? Many players including some all time greats like Mays, Aaron and Schmidt have admitted to taking them for the perks they gave them.
Some drug addict thinking something helps is completely different than something scientifically proven to help. Ive done cocaine before and I promise you it only helps you spend money and stay awake thats about it.
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@exotic_combs_psn said in Very interesting Bonds and Clemens article:
Well he hit the most home runs so it sounds like he should to me. Haha I get your point but I do not agree
Thats fine, you are entitled to your opinions as I am also. I understand also just using steroids doesn't guarantee results especially being able to hit a baseball with a bat, but it does help increase bat speed which does enhance his chance of hitting long balls. I would even goes as far as saying it helps more than taking some type of speed which would only increase someone's heart beat not bat speed. You might get a edge in concentration also depending on how the drug affects the player
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@ustoopid2_psn said in Very interesting Bonds and Clemens article:
@poksey_mlbts said in Very interesting Bonds and Clemens article:
@ustoopid2_psn said in Very interesting Bonds and Clemens article:
@poksey_mlbts said in Very interesting Bonds and Clemens article:
@ustoopid2_psn said in Very interesting Bonds and Clemens article:
@poksey_mlbts said in Very interesting Bonds and Clemens article:
We all know the main names that are in the Mitchell report, and those most suspected of PEDs. It still doesnt make sense to me that they have been blackballed while others have been inducted. Biggio, Bagwell, Pudge, Piazza. They have known and admitted amphetamine users in, as well as known and admitted cocaine users.
At this point its strictly being vindictive against certain players, while turning a blind eye towards others.
Cocaine and Speed doesn't cause your head to grow 3x larger among other body enhancements and they definitely dont turn back the clock on father time making you better at 39-40 than you were at 29-30. GTFOH
But they are illegal by the rules. They certainly have benefits, which is why people use them. It's still cheating, or knowingly breaking the rules to gain an advantage. There is obviously a difference in advantage given between substances, but the fact remains that it's still cheating.
They aren't using cocaine to play baseball better, they do cocaine to get high. People use steroids to play sports better hence why they are called Performance Enhancing Drugs. Cocaine isnt classified as a PED.
Raines kept a vial in his pocket that he would hit when he needed a pick up. You're telling me that players didnt think it helped them on the field? What about amphetamines? Many players including some all time greats like Mays, Aaron and Schmidt have admitted to taking them for the perks they gave them.
Some drug addict thinking something helps is completely different than something scientifically proven to help. Ive done cocaine before and I promise you it only helps you spend money and stay awake thats about it.
I appreciate your experience on the subject, as it's not something I have any with. I will cede the discussion at this point. I was going by what I have read in peoples quotes as well as articles. I do agree with your take on Bonds v Aaron.
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@dolenz_psn said in Very interesting Bonds and Clemens article:
In the end I don't care much one way or the other, but once you let Bond or Clemens in then you have to open the door to the possibility of letting all of the other worthy players who were either guilty or suspected of steroid use. Once they vote one of them in then things are going to get messy.
I am also of the opinion that if you used any type of enhancing drug before it was against the rules then their should be more leeway than if you used enhancers after they were specially listed as banned.
I don’t really care either way anymore. I will always choose to look at their stats and records as tainted.
But I never liked the argument that they didn’t break the rules. Steroids are and were illegal. Because MLB didn’t have a specific rule and punishment setup is just semantics. They probably don’t have a specific rule about rape or murder either but it’s still against the rules.
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@poksey_mlbts said in Very interesting Bonds and Clemens article:
@ustoopid2_psn said in Very interesting Bonds and Clemens article:
@poksey_mlbts said in Very interesting Bonds and Clemens article:
@ustoopid2_psn said in Very interesting Bonds and Clemens article:
@poksey_mlbts said in Very interesting Bonds and Clemens article:
We all know the main names that are in the Mitchell report, and those most suspected of PEDs. It still doesnt make sense to me that they have been blackballed while others have been inducted. Biggio, Bagwell, Pudge, Piazza. They have known and admitted amphetamine users in, as well as known and admitted cocaine users.
At this point its strictly being vindictive against certain players, while turning a blind eye towards others.
Cocaine and Speed doesn't cause your head to grow 3x larger among other body enhancements and they definitely dont turn back the clock on father time making you better at 39-40 than you were at 29-30. GTFOH
But they are illegal by the rules. They certainly have benefits, which is why people use them. It's still cheating, or knowingly breaking the rules to gain an advantage. There is obviously a difference in advantage given between substances, but the fact remains that it's still cheating.
They aren't using cocaine to play baseball better, they do cocaine to get high. People use steroids to play sports better hence why they are called Performance Enhancing Drugs. Cocaine isnt classified as a PED.
Raines kept a vial in his pocket that he would hit when he needed a pick up. You're telling me that players didnt think it helped them on the field? What about amphetamines? Many players including some all time greats like Mays, Aaron and Schmidt have admitted to taking them for the perks they gave them.
Taking something akin to a buttload of caffeine isn’t going to make you better at sports or aid in recuperating faster from injury.
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@dolenz_psn said in Very interesting Bonds and Clemens article:
In the end I don't care much one way or the other, but once you let Bond or Clemens in then you have to open the door to the possibility of letting all of the other worthy players who were either guilty or suspected of steroid use. Once they vote one of them in then things are going to get messy.
I am also of the opinion that if you used any type of enhancing drug before it was against the rules then their should be more leeway than if you used enhancers after they were specially listed as banned.
There is already at least one player who recently got in the HOF who admittedly used PEDs. I think they were legal when he used them (according to this player).
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