Willie Stargell MVP/ Lack of Prime series

SDS

I know awards cards look cool and all, but Stargell had easily better seasons in 71’ and 73’ where his OPS was more than .100 points greater than his MVP season. Imo, he should have a prime card, but SDS continues to neglect the prime cards.

Bottom line: SDS, give us more prime cards

Justice for Pops!

SDS

@danielfeces_psn said in Willie Stargell MVP/ Lack of Prime series:

I know awards cards look cool and all, but Stargell had easily better seasons in 71’ and 73’ where his OPS was more than .100 points greater than his MVP season. Imo, he should have a prime card, but SDS continues to neglect the prime cards.

Bottom line: SDS, give us more prime cards

Justice for Pops!

Agreed

SDS

Last year the RIB packs had a good amount of prime cards especially for relievers so I would suspect that is the case again

SDS

@danielfeces_psn said in Willie Stargell MVP/ Lack of Prime series:

Bottom line: SDS, give us more prime cards

Going to disagree, only because when you use Prime cards, you're locked into the vintage card art which, for most players, is downright awful.

Which looks better in your lineup?

... or ...

SDS

@savefarris_psn said in Willie Stargell MVP/ Lack of Prime series:

@danielfeces_psn said in Willie Stargell MVP/ Lack of Prime series:

Bottom line: SDS, give us more prime cards

Going to disagree, only because when you use Prime cards, you're locked into the vintage card art which, for most players, is downright awful.

Which looks better in your lineup?

... or ...

If the all Yellow Pirates jerseys isn't a program reward I will be UPSET!!!!

SDS

Stargell won MVP in 1979 with a 2.7 fWAR season.
That’s gotta be one of the worst (possibly the worst actually) screw-ups in voting from back then. Dave Winfield had 7.8 fWAR, with a wRC+ that’s almost 30 points higher. Just absolutely brutal how bad some people got screwed over back then.

A prime Stargell card based on like 71-74 would’ve made so much more sense, and would be way more useful for collections.

SDS

@jogger171717_psn said in Willie Stargell MVP/ Lack of Prime series:

Stargell won MVP in 1979 with a 2.7 fWAR season.
That’s gotta be one of the worst (possibly the worst actually) screw-ups in voting from back then. Dave Winfield had 7.8 fWAR, with a wRC+ that’s almost 30 points higher. Just absolutely brutal how bad some people got screwed over back then.

None of those stats existed back then. And the biggest screw up in voting history is the 2016 AL Cy young award

SDS

@jogger171717_psn said in Willie Stargell MVP/ Lack of Prime series:

Stargell won MVP in 1979 with a 2.7 fWAR season.
That’s gotta be one of the worst (possibly the worst actually) screw-ups in voting from back then. Dave Winfield had 7.8 fWAR, with a wRC+ that’s almost 30 points higher. Just absolutely brutal how bad some people got screwed over back then.

A prime Stargell card based on like 71-74 would’ve made so much more sense, and would be way more useful for collections.

These stats didn't exist then!!!!!

SDS

@the_dragon1912 said in Willie Stargell MVP/ Lack of Prime series:

@jogger171717_psn said in Willie Stargell MVP/ Lack of Prime series:

Stargell won MVP in 1979 with a 2.7 fWAR season.
That’s gotta be one of the worst (possibly the worst actually) screw-ups in voting from back then. Dave Winfield had 7.8 fWAR, with a wRC+ that’s almost 30 points higher. Just absolutely brutal how bad some people got screwed over back then.

None of those stats existed back then. And the biggest screw up in voting history is the 2016 AL Cy young award

Obviously, that’s my point. Guys got screwed over because voting was based heavily on popularity and team record, with the main stats being AVG, HR, and worst of all, RBI.

Yeah Verlander probably should’ve won in 2016, but Porcello’s numbers actually weren’t that bad.
Verlander: 3.04 ERA, 140 ERA+, 3.48 FIP, 1.001 WHIP, 6.8 H9, 1.2 HR9, 2.3 BB9, 10.0 SO9, 4.46 SO/W
Porcello: 3.15 ERA, 142 ERA+, 3.40 FIP, 1.009 WHIP, 7.8 H9, 0.9 HR9, 1.3 BB9, 7.6 SO9, 5.91 SO/W

I’d say a guy with 2.7 fWAR winning MVP over a guy with 7.8 (or even just winning MVP at all) is much worse.

SDS

@cdnmoneymaker93_xbl said in Willie Stargell MVP/ Lack of Prime series:

@jogger171717_psn said in Willie Stargell MVP/ Lack of Prime series:

Stargell won MVP in 1979 with a 2.7 fWAR season.
That’s gotta be one of the worst (possibly the worst actually) screw-ups in voting from back then. Dave Winfield had 7.8 fWAR, with a wRC+ that’s almost 30 points higher. Just absolutely brutal how bad some people got screwed over back then.

A prime Stargell card based on like 71-74 would’ve made so much more sense, and would be way more useful for collections.

These stats didn't exist then!!!!!

Thank you for pointing out the very obvious thing that everybody knows. I didn’t say they should’ve used them back then, I’m just pointing out how hilariously bad the voting looks now with modern knowledge.

Even if you look at stats that they had back then, Stargell winning MVP over Winfield was still clearly just based on popularity and team record.
Stargell: 32 HR, 82 RBI, .281 AVG, .352 OBP, .552 SLG
Winfield: 34 HR, 118 RBI, .308 AVG, .395 OBP, .558 SLG

SDS

@jogger171717_psn said in Willie Stargell MVP/ Lack of Prime series:

@the_dragon1912 said in Willie Stargell MVP/ Lack of Prime series:

@jogger171717_psn said in Willie Stargell MVP/ Lack of Prime series:

Stargell won MVP in 1979 with a 2.7 fWAR season.
That’s gotta be one of the worst (possibly the worst actually) screw-ups in voting from back then. Dave Winfield had 7.8 fWAR, with a wRC+ that’s almost 30 points higher. Just absolutely brutal how bad some people got screwed over back then.

None of those stats existed back then. And the biggest screw up in voting history is the 2016 AL Cy young award

Obviously, that’s my point. Guys got screwed over because voting was based heavily on popularity and team record, with the main stats being AVG, HR, and worst of all, RBI.

Yeah Verlander probably should’ve won in 2016, but Porcello’s numbers actually weren’t that bad.
Verlander: 3.04 ERA, 140 ERA+, 3.48 FIP, 1.001 WHIP, 6.8 H9, 1.2 HR9, 2.3 BB9, 10.0 SO9, 4.46 SO/W
Porcello: 3.15 ERA, 142 ERA+, 3.40 FIP, 1.009 WHIP, 7.8 H9, 0.9 HR9, 1.3 BB9, 7.6 SO9, 5.91 SO/W

I’d say a guy with 2.7 fWAR winning MVP over a guy with 7.8 (or even just winning MVP at all) is much worse.

Verlander is the only player in history to have more first place votes and lose the CY young. And he had 6 more first place votes. Two AL east writers left Verlander off their ballots completely. Two 5th place votes and Verlander wins. Kluber and Britton would have been better choices than Porcello. Porcello's numbers were good, but he won the award because of two writers and having a 22-4 record thanks to one of the highest run supports in league history.

I agree Stargell didn't deserve the MVP, but at least advanced stats weren't used back then. There were all the stats and Metrics in the world in 2016 and it was still the blatantly wrong choice

SDS

@the_dragon1912 said in Willie Stargell MVP/ Lack of Prime series:

@jogger171717_psn said in Willie Stargell MVP/ Lack of Prime series:

@the_dragon1912 said in Willie Stargell MVP/ Lack of Prime series:

@jogger171717_psn said in Willie Stargell MVP/ Lack of Prime series:

Stargell won MVP in 1979 with a 2.7 fWAR season.
That’s gotta be one of the worst (possibly the worst actually) screw-ups in voting from back then. Dave Winfield had 7.8 fWAR, with a wRC+ that’s almost 30 points higher. Just absolutely brutal how bad some people got screwed over back then.

None of those stats existed back then. And the biggest screw up in voting history is the 2016 AL Cy young award

Obviously, that’s my point. Guys got screwed over because voting was based heavily on popularity and team record, with the main stats being AVG, HR, and worst of all, RBI.

Yeah Verlander probably should’ve won in 2016, but Porcello’s numbers actually weren’t that bad.
Verlander: 3.04 ERA, 140 ERA+, 3.48 FIP, 1.001 WHIP, 6.8 H9, 1.2 HR9, 2.3 BB9, 10.0 SO9, 4.46 SO/W
Porcello: 3.15 ERA, 142 ERA+, 3.40 FIP, 1.009 WHIP, 7.8 H9, 0.9 HR9, 1.3 BB9, 7.6 SO9, 5.91 SO/W

I’d say a guy with 2.7 fWAR winning MVP over a guy with 7.8 (or even just winning MVP at all) is much worse.

Verlander is the only player in history to have more first place votes and lose the CY young. And he had 6 more first place votes. Two AL east writers left Verlander off their ballots completely. Two 5th place votes and Verlander wins. Kluber and Britton would have been better choices than Porcello. Porcello's numbers were good, but he won the award because of two writers and having a 22-4 record thanks to one of the highest run supports in league history.

I agree Stargell didn't deserve the MVP, but at least advanced stats weren't used back then. There were all the stats and Metrics in the world in 2016 and it was still the blatantly wrong choice

Personally, I think the winner should’ve been Britton, followed by Verlander, kluber, and porcello. The numbers between Verlander, kluber, and porcello were all extremely close though, so I really don’t think it’s fair to say it’s the worst voting incident when guys have won MVP while being considerably worse than the leader.

SDS

Don't forget the Philadelphia screw job that was 2006, Ryan Howard beating Albert Pujols.

I'm not saying this was as big a travesty, Howard had a monster season but Albert's 8.4 war was almost 3 points higher, his SLG %, BA, OBP, OPS, runs all higher.

Also, didn't Pops share the NL MVP with Keith Hernandez?

I agree on both accounts. Winfield should have won and Verlander should have won. No question on either.

SDS

@cdnmoneymaker93_xbl said

Going to disagree, only because when you use Prime cards, you're locked into the vintage card art which, for most players, is downright awful.

That example is a particularly bad picture, but there are plenty of good looking cards from back in the day to choose from. It would be nice to see some variety rather than seeing an awards or milestone card 75% of the time.

Also, reading about how Porcello won the Cy Young is just upsetting.

SDS

@jogger171717_psn said in Willie Stargell MVP/ Lack of Prime series:

@the_dragon1912 said in Willie Stargell MVP/ Lack of Prime series:

@jogger171717_psn said in Willie Stargell MVP/ Lack of Prime series:

@the_dragon1912 said in Willie Stargell MVP/ Lack of Prime series:

@jogger171717_psn said in Willie Stargell MVP/ Lack of Prime series:

Stargell won MVP in 1979 with a 2.7 fWAR season.
That’s gotta be one of the worst (possibly the worst actually) screw-ups in voting from back then. Dave Winfield had 7.8 fWAR, with a wRC+ that’s almost 30 points higher. Just absolutely brutal how bad some people got screwed over back then.

None of those stats existed back then. And the biggest screw up in voting history is the 2016 AL Cy young award

Obviously, that’s my point. Guys got screwed over because voting was based heavily on popularity and team record, with the main stats being AVG, HR, and worst of all, RBI.

Yeah Verlander probably should’ve won in 2016, but Porcello’s numbers actually weren’t that bad.
Verlander: 3.04 ERA, 140 ERA+, 3.48 FIP, 1.001 WHIP, 6.8 H9, 1.2 HR9, 2.3 BB9, 10.0 SO9, 4.46 SO/W
Porcello: 3.15 ERA, 142 ERA+, 3.40 FIP, 1.009 WHIP, 7.8 H9, 0.9 HR9, 1.3 BB9, 7.6 SO9, 5.91 SO/W

I’d say a guy with 2.7 fWAR winning MVP over a guy with 7.8 (or even just winning MVP at all) is much worse.

Verlander is the only player in history to have more first place votes and lose the CY young. And he had 6 more first place votes. Two AL east writers left Verlander off their ballots completely. Two 5th place votes and Verlander wins. Kluber and Britton would have been better choices than Porcello. Porcello's numbers were good, but he won the award because of two writers and having a 22-4 record thanks to one of the highest run supports in league history.

I agree Stargell didn't deserve the MVP, but at least advanced stats weren't used back then. There were all the stats and Metrics in the world in 2016 and it was still the blatantly wrong choice

Dupe

SDS

@savefarris_psn said in Willie Stargell MVP/ Lack of Prime series:

@danielfeces_psn said in Willie Stargell MVP/ Lack of Prime series:

Bottom line: SDS, give us more prime cards

Going to disagree, only because when you use Prime cards, you're locked into the vintage card art which, for most players, is downright awful.

Which looks better in your lineup?

... or ...

i love the old cards how they look

SDS

RIB Possible Prime or other cards
Kirby Pucket
Tony Perez
Jeff Bagwell
Gagne
Killebrew
Andruw Jones
John Franco
Rod Carew
Will Clark
Robin Yount
Louis Aparicio
Troy Percival
Chris Sale
Tino Martinez
Houston Street
Richie Ashburn
Jack Morris
Don Sutton
Heath Bell

SDS

@savefarris_psn said in Willie Stargell MVP/ Lack of Prime series:

Which looks better in your lineup?

I would give all my stubs for the Awards one. It's so pretty...

SDS

@the_dragon1912 said in Willie Stargell MVP/ Lack of Prime series:

@jogger171717_psn said in Willie Stargell MVP/ Lack of Prime series:

Stargell won MVP in 1979 with a 2.7 fWAR season.
That’s gotta be one of the worst (possibly the worst actually) screw-ups in voting from back then. Dave Winfield had 7.8 fWAR, with a wRC+ that’s almost 30 points higher. Just absolutely brutal how bad some people got screwed over back then.

None of those stats existed back then. And the biggest screw up in voting history is the 2016 AL Cy young award

Check out the 1934 AL MVP. Imagine anyone voting Mickey Cochrane over Lou Gehrig today.

SDS

@poksey_mlbts said in Willie Stargell MVP/ Lack of Prime series:

@the_dragon1912 said in Willie Stargell MVP/ Lack of Prime series:

@jogger171717_psn said in Willie Stargell MVP/ Lack of Prime series:

Stargell won MVP in 1979 with a 2.7 fWAR season.
That’s gotta be one of the worst (possibly the worst actually) screw-ups in voting from back then. Dave Winfield had 7.8 fWAR, with a wRC+ that’s almost 30 points higher. Just absolutely brutal how bad some people got screwed over back then.

None of those stats existed back then. And the biggest screw up in voting history is the 2016 AL Cy young award

Check out the 1934 AL MVP. Imagine anyone voting Mickey Cochrane over Lou Gehrig today.

Cochrane even getting the MVP over Charlie Gehringer that same year is asinine lmao. Gehrig is clearly the most deserving there, but Gehringer is at least acceptable