Joey Votto July POTM Card Please and Thank You
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@schnauzerface said in Joey Votto July POTM Card Please and Thank You:
I love Joey Votto and I think it would be a shame if he didn't get in, but I think he's probably going to be one of those guys who will need to generate a lot of steam with the voters over time. He's definitely not Kershaw or Miggy or Pujols or Trout or one of these guys who could retire tomorrow and still be a first-ballot HoFer with 98%+ votes. And he's probably not even in the tier with guys like Greinke and Buster Posey who should (and probably will eventually) get in, but it might be borderline in some voters' eyes. I think he's more along the lines of a Paul Goldschmidt -- someone who may not retire with any of the sexy milestone numbers (3000 hits, 500 HR), but was really, reeeally [censored] good (and probably better than most people might realize), but unfortunately didn't spend most of their careers on high-profile winning teams so they didn't get the attention they deserved.
Very well said, definitely agree.
Whether he gets in or not....he’s a Hall of Famer in my eyes lol
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@doobiebross66-72 said in Joey Votto July POTM Card Please and Thank You:
@schnauzerface said in Joey Votto July POTM Card Please and Thank You:
I love Joey Votto and I think it would be a shame if he didn't get in, but I think he's probably going to be one of those guys who will need to generate a lot of steam with the voters over time. He's definitely not Kershaw or Miggy or Pujols or Trout or one of these guys who could retire tomorrow and still be a first-ballot HoFer with 98%+ votes. And he's probably not even in the tier with guys like Greinke and Buster Posey who should (and probably will eventually) get in, but it might be borderline in some voters' eyes. I think he's more along the lines of a Paul Goldschmidt -- someone who may not retire with any of the sexy milestone numbers (3000 hits, 500 HR), but was really, reeeally [censored] good (and probably better than most people might realize), but unfortunately didn't spend most of their careers on high-profile winning teams so they didn't get the attention they deserved.
Very well said, definitely agree.
Whether he gets in or not....he’s a Hall of Famer in my eyes lol
I just checked Votto's baseball reference and he has 62.4 career WAR.I am admittedly not a WAR expert, but that's more than I would have guessed. He's only 6 WAR behind Miggy. If Votto has at least a couple more decent seasons and can retire with 65+ then I think it'd be hard to deny him a spot.
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He’s had an extremely similar career to Todd Helton. Do a side by side comparison.
And I don’t think Helton gets in, at least anytime soon.
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@genopolanco_psn said in Joey Votto July POTM Card Please and Thank You:
He’s had an extremely similar career to Todd Helton. Do a side by side comparison.
And I don’t think Helton gets in, at least anytime soon.
I don't think Helton gets in unfortunately. I think the only reason Walker got in was because he had enough productive years in Montreal and St. Louis that they got over the Coors effect, which the voters take way too seriously
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@the_dragon1912 said in Joey Votto July POTM Card Please and Thank You:
@genopolanco_psn said in Joey Votto July POTM Card Please and Thank You:
He’s had an extremely similar career to Todd Helton. Do a side by side comparison.
And I don’t think Helton gets in, at least anytime soon.
I don't think Helton gets in unfortunately. I think the only reason Walker got in was because he had enough productive years in Montreal and St. Louis that they got over the Coors effect, which the voters take way too seriously
I agree. And it’s funny how they penalize hitters but don’t use it as a benefit for pitchers. Granted we haven’t had many great pitchers anyway.
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@the_dragon1912 said in Joey Votto July POTM Card Please and Thank You:
@genopolanco_psn said in Joey Votto July POTM Card Please and Thank You:
He’s had an extremely similar career to Todd Helton. Do a side by side comparison.
And I don’t think Helton gets in, at least anytime soon.
I don't think Helton gets in unfortunately. I think the only reason Walker got in was because he had enough productive years in Montreal and St. Louis that they got over the Coors effect, which the voters take way too seriously
He was also considered to have a good arm, and a good enough fielder in RF, which probably helped his cause more than Heltons fielding at 1B. Add in his threat as a baserunner, and those may have taken him over the top for voting, when they had similar offensive numbers at the plate.
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@poksey_mlbts said in Joey Votto July POTM Card Please and Thank You:
@the_dragon1912 said in Joey Votto July POTM Card Please and Thank You:
@genopolanco_psn said in Joey Votto July POTM Card Please and Thank You:
He’s had an extremely similar career to Todd Helton. Do a side by side comparison.
And I don’t think Helton gets in, at least anytime soon.
I don't think Helton gets in unfortunately. I think the only reason Walker got in was because he had enough productive years in Montreal and St. Louis that they got over the Coors effect, which the voters take way too seriously
He was also considered to have a good arm, and a good enough fielder in RF, which probably helped his cause more than Heltons fielding at 1B. Add in his threat as a baserunner, and those may have taken him over the top for voting, when they had similar offensive numbers at the plate.
Very true. Unless Arenado's career takes off with the cardinals he won't make it in either IMO. HOF voters are notoriously stingy about 3rd baseman and even if he is one of the greatest defenders at 3B of all time, that probably won't be enough, because his offensive numbers are significantly worse than Walker and Heltons are. All in all it might be a long time before we see another Rockie in the HOF
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@the_dragon1912 said in Joey Votto July POTM Card Please and Thank You:
You must not know much about the HOF voting if you think Votto is a solidified HOFer. Do I think he should be? Yes absolutely. But the old geezers that vote for that [censored] are just going to look at him, see not nearly as many hits and homers as Miggy and Pujols, and kick him on his way
If you're going to compare him to Pujols, then yeah, he's going to be kicked off to the side. Miggy was pretty [censored] good too.
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@the_dragon1912 said in Joey Votto July POTM Card Please and Thank You:
You must not know much about the HOF voting if you think Votto is a solidified HOFer. Do I think he should be? Yes absolutely. But the old geezers that vote for that [censored] are just going to look at him, see not nearly as many hits and homers as Miggy and Pujols, and kick him on his way
It's a joke. A bunch of people who never played pro ball, or maybe even high school ball, sitting in an office deciding which players get to make the hall of fame.
The hall of fame is supposed to paint the picture of baseball history, not reflect the opinions of a group of nerds.
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@go4stros25_psn said in Joey Votto July POTM Card Please and Thank You:
@the_dragon1912 said in Joey Votto July POTM Card Please and Thank You:
You must not know much about the HOF voting if you think Votto is a solidified HOFer. Do I think he should be? Yes absolutely. But the old geezers that vote for that [censored] are just going to look at him, see not nearly as many hits and homers as Miggy and Pujols, and kick him on his way
It's a joke. A bunch of people who never played pro ball, or maybe even high school ball, sitting in an office deciding which players get to make the hall of fame.
The hall of fame is supposed to paint the picture of baseball history, not reflect the opinions of a group of nerds.
I agree with you completely. It should be voted on by groups of former players and coaches. The way it is now if you look at reporters the wrong way it might make them not vote for you. (I mean the same group of people voted Rick Porcello over Verlander, Kluber AND Britton for Cy young in 2016, they got to change something)
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@doobiebross66-72 said in Joey Votto July POTM Card Please and Thank You:
The man is unconscious right now! And doing it against the Cubs which just warms my heart.
Would love to see Votto get a POTM card, of my lifetime so far, he’s been my favorite Reds player and a solidified Hall of Famer at this point.
Maybe a 95+ diamond in the POTM Program?
Thing about Votto, who is having a pretty similar month to Goldschmidt, and not quite as good a month as Freeman (except for HRs) is that I believe that they will all get boosted Cards later on. Maybe Signature Series, or TA4, or maybe a Freeman MVP card. So, the question is will SDS want to devalue those future cards by giving one of them a POTM Card? Of the three, Freeman is the most deserving for his play this month.
Personally, I prefer to see the POTM cards go to players who probably have no other chance at a better card this year. Guys like Kyle Farmer or Harrison Bader.
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@doobiebross66-72 said in Joey Votto July POTM Card Please and Thank You:
The man is unconscious right now! And doing it against the Cubs which just warms my heart.
Would love to see Votto get a POTM card, of my lifetime so far, he’s been my favorite Reds player and a solidified Hall of Famer at this point.
Maybe a 95+ diamond in the POTM Program?
Awwwe we got a homer here!!! That’s absolutely precious!!!
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@dolenz_psn said in Joey Votto July POTM Card Please and Thank You:
@doobiebross66-72 said in Joey Votto July POTM Card Please and Thank You:
The man is unconscious right now! And doing it against the Cubs which just warms my heart.
Would love to see Votto get a POTM card, of my lifetime so far, he’s been my favorite Reds player and a solidified Hall of Famer at this point.
Maybe a 95+ diamond in the POTM Program?
Thing about Votto, who is having a pretty similar month to Goldschmidt, and not quite as good a month as Freeman (except for HRs) is that I believe that they will all get boosted Cards later on. Maybe Signature Series, or TA4, or maybe a Freeman MVP card. So, the question is will SDS want to devalue those future cards by giving one of them a POTM Card? Of the three, Freeman is the most deserving for his play this month.
Personally, I prefer to see the POTM cards go to players who probably have no other chance at a better card this year. Guys like Kyle Farmer or Harrison Bader.
If any of those get the POTM lightning it won't devalue any future cards for them, well, because another card wouldn't be released at that point
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@killerpresence4 said in Joey Votto July POTM Card Please and Thank You:
@doobiebross66-72 said in Joey Votto July POTM Card Please and Thank You:
The man is unconscious right now! And doing it against the Cubs which just warms my heart.
Would love to see Votto get a POTM card, of my lifetime so far, he’s been my favorite Reds player and a solidified Hall of Famer at this point.
Maybe a 95+ diamond in the POTM Program?
Awwwe we got a homer here!!! That’s absolutely precious!!!
Nothing wrong with being a homer and making the suggestion if it is warranted. It is not like Votto has not had an excellent month. .325 average, 9 HRs and a six consecutive game HR streak.
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@the_dragon1912 said in Joey Votto July POTM Card Please and Thank You:
@genopolanco_psn said in Joey Votto July POTM Card Please and Thank You:
He’s had an extremely similar career to Todd Helton. Do a side by side comparison.
And I don’t think Helton gets in, at least anytime soon.
I don't think Helton gets in unfortunately. I think the only reason Walker got in was because he had enough productive years in Montreal and St. Louis that they got over the Coors effect, which the voters take way too seriously
Hate to break it to you bud but the Coors effect is scientifically justified.
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@the_dragon1912 said in Joey Votto July POTM Card Please and Thank You:
@go4stros25_psn said in Joey Votto July POTM Card Please and Thank You:
@the_dragon1912 said in Joey Votto July POTM Card Please and Thank You:
You must not know much about the HOF voting if you think Votto is a solidified HOFer. Do I think he should be? Yes absolutely. But the old geezers that vote for that [censored] are just going to look at him, see not nearly as many hits and homers as Miggy and Pujols, and kick him on his way
It's a joke. A bunch of people who never played pro ball, or maybe even high school ball, sitting in an office deciding which players get to make the hall of fame.
The hall of fame is supposed to paint the picture of baseball history, not reflect the opinions of a group of nerds.
I agree with you completely. It should be voted on by groups of former players and coaches. The way it is now if you look at reporters the wrong way it might make them not vote for you. (I mean the same group of people voted Rick Porcello over Verlander, Kluber AND Britton for Cy young in 2016, they got to change something)
But on the opposite end of that, you see former players hold grudges too. You think Jordan would have voted for Isaiah Thomas for HOF?
I've also listened to Shaq say things about current players that are idiotic, as well as Keyshawn have no respect for Kyler Murray because of the Kingsbury offense.I would rather they have a combination of both, like they currently do with the writers and the veterans committee. But then, we get Harold Baines voted in, so who knows what the best method is, lol.
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@dolenz_psn said in Joey Votto July POTM Card Please and Thank You:
@killerpresence4 said in Joey Votto July POTM Card Please and Thank You:
@doobiebross66-72 said in Joey Votto July POTM Card Please and Thank You:
The man is unconscious right now! And doing it against the Cubs which just warms my heart.
Would love to see Votto get a POTM card, of my lifetime so far, he’s been my favorite Reds player and a solidified Hall of Famer at this point.
Maybe a 95+ diamond in the POTM Program?
Awwwe we got a homer here!!! That’s absolutely precious!!!
Nothing wrong with being a homer and making the suggestion if it is warranted. It is not like Votto has not had an excellent month. .325 average, 9 HRs and a six consecutive game HR streak.
I’m not saying that there is anything wrong with it, but a 10 game stretch doesn’t equal a months worth of production. There are guys out there with far better months than Votto. I mean Freddie Freeman is batting well over .400 for the month with 9 homers and a 10 game stretch where he literally swung and missed at a pitch zero times. And that’s just one guy with a better month. You’ve got others like Goldschmidt and Bader with better resumes for the month. Also, his claim about Votto being a sure fire HOF’er is a bit of a stretch. He is on the backside of his career and hasn’t even eclipse 2000 hits yet. He doesn’t play premium defense and hasn’t for several years and he plays first which is an offensive position. So saying he’s a HOF’er at this point is pipe dream. That’s just my take.
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@poksey_mlbts said in Joey Votto July POTM Card Please and Thank You:
@the_dragon1912 said in Joey Votto July POTM Card Please and Thank You:
@go4stros25_psn said in Joey Votto July POTM Card Please and Thank You:
@the_dragon1912 said in Joey Votto July POTM Card Please and Thank You:
You must not know much about the HOF voting if you think Votto is a solidified HOFer. Do I think he should be? Yes absolutely. But the old geezers that vote for that [censored] are just going to look at him, see not nearly as many hits and homers as Miggy and Pujols, and kick him on his way
It's a joke. A bunch of people who never played pro ball, or maybe even high school ball, sitting in an office deciding which players get to make the hall of fame.
The hall of fame is supposed to paint the picture of baseball history, not reflect the opinions of a group of nerds.
I agree with you completely. It should be voted on by groups of former players and coaches. The way it is now if you look at reporters the wrong way it might make them not vote for you. (I mean the same group of people voted Rick Porcello over Verlander, Kluber AND Britton for Cy young in 2016, they got to change something)
But on the opposite end of that, you see former players hold grudges too. You think Jordan would have voted for Isaiah Thomas for HOF?
I've also listened to Shaq say things about current players that are idiotic, as well as Keyshawn have no respect for Kyler Murray because of the Kingsbury offense.I would rather they have a combination of both, like they currently do with the writers and the veterans committee. But then, we get Harold Baines voted in, so who knows what the best method is, lol.
Yea I do believe Jordan would’ve voted for Isaiah Thomas to be a HOF’er. Just because they were bitter rivals doesn’t mean there wasn’t mutual respect.
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@killerpresence4 said in Joey Votto July POTM Card Please and Thank You:
@poksey_mlbts said in Joey Votto July POTM Card Please and Thank You:
@the_dragon1912 said in Joey Votto July POTM Card Please and Thank You:
@go4stros25_psn said in Joey Votto July POTM Card Please and Thank You:
@the_dragon1912 said in Joey Votto July POTM Card Please and Thank You:
You must not know much about the HOF voting if you think Votto is a solidified HOFer. Do I think he should be? Yes absolutely. But the old geezers that vote for that [censored] are just going to look at him, see not nearly as many hits and homers as Miggy and Pujols, and kick him on his way
It's a joke. A bunch of people who never played pro ball, or maybe even high school ball, sitting in an office deciding which players get to make the hall of fame.
The hall of fame is supposed to paint the picture of baseball history, not reflect the opinions of a group of nerds.
I agree with you completely. It should be voted on by groups of former players and coaches. The way it is now if you look at reporters the wrong way it might make them not vote for you. (I mean the same group of people voted Rick Porcello over Verlander, Kluber AND Britton for Cy young in 2016, they got to change something)
But on the opposite end of that, you see former players hold grudges too. You think Jordan would have voted for Isaiah Thomas for HOF?
I've also listened to Shaq say things about current players that are idiotic, as well as Keyshawn have no respect for Kyler Murray because of the Kingsbury offense.I would rather they have a combination of both, like they currently do with the writers and the veterans committee. But then, we get Harold Baines voted in, so who knows what the best method is, lol.
Yea I do believe Jordan would’ve voted for Isaiah Thomas to be a HOF’er. Just because they were bitter rivals doesn’t mean there wasn’t mutual respect.
He made sure he wasnt on the Olympic Dream Team even though he was deserving of being on it. I dont think that qualifies as respect.
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@poksey_mlbts said in Joey Votto July POTM Card Please and Thank You:
@killerpresence4 said in Joey Votto July POTM Card Please and Thank You:
@poksey_mlbts said in Joey Votto July POTM Card Please and Thank You:
@the_dragon1912 said in Joey Votto July POTM Card Please and Thank You:
@go4stros25_psn said in Joey Votto July POTM Card Please and Thank You:
@the_dragon1912 said in Joey Votto July POTM Card Please and Thank You:
You must not know much about the HOF voting if you think Votto is a solidified HOFer. Do I think he should be? Yes absolutely. But the old geezers that vote for that [censored] are just going to look at him, see not nearly as many hits and homers as Miggy and Pujols, and kick him on his way
It's a joke. A bunch of people who never played pro ball, or maybe even high school ball, sitting in an office deciding which players get to make the hall of fame.
The hall of fame is supposed to paint the picture of baseball history, not reflect the opinions of a group of nerds.
I agree with you completely. It should be voted on by groups of former players and coaches. The way it is now if you look at reporters the wrong way it might make them not vote for you. (I mean the same group of people voted Rick Porcello over Verlander, Kluber AND Britton for Cy young in 2016, they got to change something)
But on the opposite end of that, you see former players hold grudges too. You think Jordan would have voted for Isaiah Thomas for HOF?
I've also listened to Shaq say things about current players that are idiotic, as well as Keyshawn have no respect for Kyler Murray because of the Kingsbury offense.I would rather they have a combination of both, like they currently do with the writers and the veterans committee. But then, we get Harold Baines voted in, so who knows what the best method is, lol.
Yea I do believe Jordan would’ve voted for Isaiah Thomas to be a HOF’er. Just because they were bitter rivals doesn’t mean there wasn’t mutual respect.
He made sure he wasnt on the Olympic Dream Team even though he was deserving of being on it. I dont think that qualifies as respect.
That is a completely different situation, you’re comparing apples to oranges. In that situation they were trying to form a team that could gel together. We all know that those two did not like each other. Most of that because of the eastern conference finals battles in the early 90’s when Isaiah was leading one of the dirtiest teams in the league. It would be kind of hard for those two to form any sort of chemistry together in the Olympics given the short period of time those guys had to prepare for those Olympics.
