SDS Logic
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This post is deleted!
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Just delete the game and move on.
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All sports games are like this sadly. Somehow the peak of current RNG coincides with the peak of 1v1 H2H online play.
You could say the RNG is the devs attempt to level the playing field and it probably is although none of them would admit it.
What the sports games focus on PVP did IMO is absolutely kill AI development. Think about any sports game and the point they decided to go with more H2H online vs solo play? From that point in time did the AI ever evolve past that? If anything the AI has gotten worse in most sports games because it is completely neglected.
You can see how unimportant AI intelligence is for all of these sports game makers, few devs or marketing people have touted improved AI intelligence as a feature.
If we are playing H2H and the stupid AI isn't hurting either of us and the RNG isn't favoring either of us too much, job done. No complaints. But every time and look, it's way more frequent than it should be, every time it's skewed one way more than the other you are going to get complaints. These complaints are justified because this is a horse s h i t way to make games. But it's the easiest way to make games. Because there are no accolades for having the best AI intelligence in a sports game, nobody bothers making the AI smart.
But what it boils down to is skill isn't as much a factor each year in sports games. Pressing the correct button and lucking out with the best RNG result possible is all you can do. You are basically watching a sports movie play out and pressing buttons.
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@worldrevolver said in SDS Logic:
All sports games are like this sadly. Somehow the peak of current RNG coincides with the peak of 1v1 H2H online play.
You could say the RNG is the devs attempt to level the playing field and it probably is although none of them would admit it.
What the sports games focus on PVP did IMO is absolutely kill AI development. Think about any sports game and the point they decided to go with more H2H online vs solo play? From that point in time did the AI ever evolve past that? If anything the AI has gotten worse in most sports games because it is completely neglected.
You can see how unimportant AI intelligence is for all of these sports game makers, few devs or marketing people have touted improved AI intelligence as a feature.
If we are playing H2H and the stupid AI isn't hurting either us and the RNG isn't favoring either of us too much, job done. No complaints. But every time and look, it's way more frequent than it should be, every time it's skewed one way more than the other you are going to get complaints. These complaints are justified because this is a horse s h i t way to make games. But it's the easiest way to make games. Because there are no accolades for having the best AI intelligence in a sports game, nobody bothers making the AI smart.
But what it boils down to is skill isn't as much a factor each year in sports games. Pressing the correct button and lucking out with the best RNG result possible is all you can do. You are basically watching a sports movie play out and pressing buttons.
I do agree with your resume sentence, since they seem to have implemented a weighting algorithm to control the outcome on hits and plays, for those who do not know programming, its basically a way to put a master parameter, that can cause you to either be in tight difficult innings often, have no success whatsoever hitting, or even flat out win/lose the game. So say this parameter is default 50, if they put 30 for you, you are in deep excrement. Otherwise, if by some reason (like buying stubs often) that parameter is over 50 for you then.. you can play it with a bandana in your eyes, you will win!.
Before you get angry with SDS, they did this to try and make the game more natural, because oddly enough, if you base the game odds just on the players numbers, weird stuff is happening alright! Also they can discreetly either punish or reward certain players for certain reasons.
I think they do have another subsystem that depends on this one, which rewards you not making a lot of bad swings with getting good hits even if your timing is off, and another example is when your pitcher has a lot of confidence, you can pretty much throw it middle center cut, rarely you will get a hit. Only way to punish this abuse of the odds in your favor for your performance so far, is if the opponent hits with a perfect contact, or the pitcher/ batter matchup is way in favor of the batter. Still I believe real baseball, has no penance or rewards: you can do 50 bad swings and next inning put together 3 consecutive homers and win the game! But they for some reason think this is a bad idea?
Btw, what is RNG and H2H ?
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H2H is head to head gaming. PvP player vs player.
RNG random number generator. Basically in terms of coding it is why you can make the AI pitch you a fastball center cut and time it perfect perfect and get a lazy fly ball, a hard liner, a homer, a ground ball, a swinging bunt and even a foul ball off the same input.
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@worldrevolver said in SDS Logic:
H2H is head to head gaming. PvP player vs player.
RNG random number generator. Basically in terms of coding it is why you can make the AI pitch you a fastball center cut and time it perfect perfect and get a lazy fly ball, a hard liner, a homer, a ground ball, a swinging bunt and even a foul ball off the same input.
Oh I see, so you think they are doing it like that? Interesting approach, can definitively see it happening, although I believe they have also a weighting algorithm in place, that can cause even the first baseman to drop the ball on the throw, fielding mistakes, offline throws, and my personal favorite, dead center balls causing walkoff homers. Still yes I think the random number for outcome assignation is definitively happening most likely than not. Thing is I believe the weights are in place because I have seen the odds of the game react in a very "organized" fashion. If it was all only like you mentioned, you could not perceive punishing and rewarding game moments in a period/loop, like it happens.
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I firmly believe hitting works like this. You can apply this same result table type rng to everything else in the game.
Basically divide the K box into 9 zones. Then you have different pitches and different timing and pci location.
So let's say a pitch is thrown middle high so
123
456
789
it's thrown in zone 2. You line the PCI up perfectly and have good timing.Game then goes into RNG and consults the table for Zone 2 Good contact Good timing and there are results -
single left 5%
single right 5%
shallow flyball 20%
lineout 10%
Homerun 10%
Warning Track flyball 30%
foul ball 20%.You then get one of those results handed to you and that is what your swing generated.
If you want to see this concept in action go into practice mode. Make the pitcher throw you the same pitch in the exact same location and place your PCI there. Now note your results with good timing and good pci. They will be all over the place.
This also explains why a Perfect Perfect can generate a foul ball. It means SDS has placed foul ball in the P/P result table for some bizarre reason.
Using this hit generator "method" they can tweak hit success easily. If solid contact on middle up pitches is below league average they just delete some of the out or foul ball entries and add in more hit entries in that result table.
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They do it this way because they have no skill when it comes to coding
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@worldrevolver said in SDS Logic:
I firmly believe hitting works like this. You can apply this same result table type rng to everything else in the game.
Basically divide the K box into 9 zones. Then you have different pitches and different timing and pci location.
So let's say a pitch is thrown middle high so
123
456
789
it's thrown in zone 2. You line the PCI up perfectly and have good timing.Game then goes into RNG and consults the table for Zone 2 Good contact Good timing and there are results -
single left 5%
single right 5%
shallow flyball 20%
lineout 10%
Homerun 10%
Warning Track flyball 30%
foul ball 20%.You then get one of those results handed to you and that is what your swing generated.
If you want to see this concept in action go into practice mode. Make the pitcher throw you the same pitch in the exact same location and place your PCI there. Now note your results with good timing and good pci. They will be all over the place.
This also explains why a Perfect Perfect can generate a foul ball. It means SDS has placed foul ball in the P/P result table for some bizarre reason.
Using this hit generator "method" they can tweak hit success easily. If solid contact on middle up pitches is below league average they just delete some of the out or foul ball entries and add in more hit entries in that result table.
I will make tests on the practice mode to see. Still if it work just like this, then is more black jack baseball than real plain baseball all together.
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Yeah and to also add, by this time in the game's life cycle they have many entries in the hit tables. This makes it "harder" to see what they are doing with the hitting. More hit results means more random. So each year when they would say something like we added more hit variety, what they did was just capture new batted ball result animations and added those to existing tables.
This also explains why we see mysterious things happen. It would most likely be a wrong entry in a table. Foul in perfect perfect table. Too many fouls in one hit table. Too many pop ups in another. Like say like most companies the Table naming structure is cryptic. Instead of being named GGhitcenterleft the table is probably named XWrc2956ll34g. So if someone new or someone who had not worked on a particular team who did this work came in and assigned hit types to the wrong folder, bingo, weird results.
Another example would be 2 years ago? 3? When SDS were on twitch streams in dev mode and showing hit variety. They were displaying how they had hooks and slices for hits. Looked great. Where did they go? I haven't seen a hook or slice off the bat in 21 except for when I rip one foul. So it's like they removed hooks and slices from all tables except foul result tables.
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Need to add topspin back, 17 had the best hitting engine, the ball moved more naturally imo and you would hit hard liners off the wall, haven't seen that since, now if it ain't gone it just hangs up for the OF to catch
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@worldrevolver said in SDS Logic:
I firmly believe hitting works like this. You can apply this same result table type rng to everything else in the game.
Basically divide the K box into 9 zones. Then you have different pitches and different timing and pci location.
So let's say a pitch is thrown middle high so
123
456
789
it's thrown in zone 2. You line the PCI up perfectly and have good timing.Game then goes into RNG and consults the table for Zone 2 Good contact Good timing and there are results -
single left 5%
single right 5%
shallow flyball 20%
lineout 10%
Homerun 10%
Warning Track flyball 30%
foul ball 20%.You then get one of those results handed to you and that is what your swing generated.
If you want to see this concept in action go into practice mode. Make the pitcher throw you the same pitch in the exact same location and place your PCI there. Now note your results with good timing and good pci. They will be all over the place.
This also explains why a Perfect Perfect can generate a foul ball. It means SDS has placed foul ball in the P/P result table for some bizarre reason.
Using this hit generator "method" they can tweak hit success easily. If solid contact on middle up pitches is below league average they just delete some of the out or foul ball entries and add in more hit entries in that result table.
I'd like to point out that this poster gets the concept of RNG.
It was a simple outline of what is probably taking place but does not include the variables for pitching timing, pitch type, stadium elevation and momentum.
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@raylewissb47_psn said in SDS Logic:
Just delete the game and move on.
Go [censored] yourself......and move on.
SDS can do the same. Good good....perfect perfect outs on every mode.....but wanna let the game be absolutely plagued by very late contact swings with the pci nowhere close to ball be allowed not only for hits but for home runs online? You the kinda [censored] benefiting from a broken hitting engine who couldn't do [censored] otherwise.
[censored]......S......D.....S
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@sdiddy85_psn said in SDS Logic:
@raylewissb47_psn said in SDS Logic:
Just delete the game and move on.
Go [censored] yourself......and move on.
SDS can do the same. Good good....perfect perfect outs on every mode.....but wanna let the game be absolutely plagued by very late contact swings with the pci nowhere close to ball be allowed not only for hits but for home runs online? You the kinda [censored] benefiting from a broken hitting engine who couldn't do [censored] otherwise.
[censored]......S......D.....S
See you tomorrow
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@worldrevolver said in SDS Logic:
I firmly believe hitting works like this. You can apply this same result table type rng to everything else in the game.
Basically divide the K box into 9 zones. Then you have different pitches and different timing and pci location.
So let's say a pitch is thrown middle high so
123
456
789
it's thrown in zone 2. You line the PCI up perfectly and have good timing.Game then goes into RNG and consults the table for Zone 2 Good contact Good timing and there are results -
single left 5%
single right 5%
shallow flyball 20%
lineout 10%
Homerun 10%
Warning Track flyball 30%
foul ball 20%.You then get one of those results handed to you and that is what your swing generated.
If you want to see this concept in action go into practice mode. Make the pitcher throw you the same pitch in the exact same location and place your PCI there. Now note your results with good timing and good pci. They will be all over the place.
This also explains why a Perfect Perfect can generate a foul ball. It means SDS has placed foul ball in the P/P result table for some bizarre reason.
Using this hit generator "method" they can tweak hit success easily. If solid contact on middle up pitches is below league average they just delete some of the out or foul ball entries and add in more hit entries in that result table.
An interesting and valid perspective, I expect that there's more like 81 (nine in each of the basic nine) or more, eg 576 (64 in each of the nine) zones rather than just nine total zones though. The results such as those you provide would vary from player to player based on their tendencies and attributes I would expect.
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@worterror_psn said in SDS Logic:
They do it this way because they have no skill when it comes to coding
incorrect
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@sdiddy85_psn said in SDS Logic:
@raylewissb47_psn said in SDS Logic:
Just delete the game and move on.
Go [censored] yourself......and move on.
SDS can do the same. Good good....perfect perfect outs on every mode.....but wanna let the game be absolutely plagued by very late contact swings with the pci nowhere close to ball be allowed not only for hits but for home runs online? You the kinda [censored] benefiting from a broken hitting engine who couldn't do [censored] otherwise.
[censored]......S......D.....S
It only took you nearly a month to come up with that gem. Feel better, buddy?
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