Moments in 20
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I get what you're saying and see that you are clearly taking the side of the top 25%. I appreciate that, so I'll stop trying to sell you on my point. Strictly speaking about myself, I buy games to complete them. I am fully aware that there may be challenges, but I won't purchase a game with content directed at only upper echelon players. Hard is fine, borderline impossible is not....its an impossible situation for SDS and one in which they can't make everyone happy, that is what you are saying and you are correct. My final thought would be "What percentage would be higher? Upper echelon players still ok with hard but not borderline impossible moments versus the percentage of average to below average players that feel defeated by borderline impossible game content?" They could be tuned down, still be hard, and still offer this difficult content that you enjoy. Seeing as though the forum has been begging for this all year, and little has changed, I was hoping that they would not be present in MLB20.
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@FranchyzeMan said in Moments in 20:
I get what you're saying and see that you are clearly taking the side of the top 25%. I appreciate that, so I'll stop trying to sell you on my point. Strictly speaking about myself, I buy games to complete them. I am fully aware that there may be challenges, but I won't purchase a game with content directed at only upper echelon players. Hard is fine, borderline impossible is not....its an impossible situation for SDS and one in which they can't make everyone happy, that is what you are saying and you are correct. My final thought would be "What percentage would be higher? Upper echelon players still ok with hard but not borderline impossible moments versus the percentage of average to below average players that feel defeated by borderline impossible game content?" They could be tuned down, still be hard, and still offer this difficult content that you enjoy. Seeing as though the forum has been begging for this all year, and little has changed, I was hoping that they would not be present in MLB20.
I already dealt with the what % is higher. Yes, 75% is higher, BUTTT 99.9% of the 75% aren't going to quit the franchise over a few moments. That is why I said
"I'm willing to bet that most of the "average" group will not be mad enough to quit the game because they can't do a small portion of it, I would say you are likely the outlier in that group."
That is why it makes sense to do a small % of hard moments for the 25%, because it's not going to cause a mass exodus and fulfills what that 25% wants.
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My point is that there is a solution to upset even less....I was really trying that time.....dang...
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I can't contribute to this conversation because I avoid Moments but I do need to point out I am really enjoying your civilised discussion, thank you to you both.
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@FranchyzeMan said in Moments in 20:
My point is that there is a solution to upset even less....I was really trying that time.....dang...
It would make the 25% upset, because they want a challenge. If you make moments that all the 75% can do, it's not a challenge.
Realistically not all the 75% is upset because of how low % of hard moments meant for the 25%, they have like 2% of the game and most people are going to be ok with SDS catering 2% to the 25% -
@eatyum said in Moments in 20:
It would make the 25% upset, because they want a challenge. If you make moments that all the 75% can do, it's not a challenge.
Well everybody should have the opportunity to complete them, it's just that some might need weeks (like me from the sounds of it) and some others hours (the 25% being referred to).
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@Red_Ted_is_back said in Moments in 20:
@eatyum said in Moments in 20:
@FranchyzeMan said in Moments in 20:
My point is that there is a solution to upset even less....I was really trying that time.....dang...
It would make the 25% upset, because they want a challenge. If you make moments that all the 75% can do, it's not a challenge.
Well everybody should have the opportunity to complete them, it's just that some might need weeks (like me from the sounds of it) and some others hours (the 25% being referred to).
Yes, but I'm speaking in general terms, yes the 75% could complete it if given time, but not everyone is going to devote that time to it.
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You're the man eatyum....great debate and valid points from both sides.....probably 25- 50% of the many that I completed took me hours to complete. Moments Extreme and Story Lines support my point more accurately so I stuck with those. I will say that I have never felt this frustrated since MLB15, when I first started playing The Show.
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@eatyum
Agreed. It's just like rewarding trophies for completing games on higher difficulty levels. Not everybody wants to complete The Last of Us on Grounded difficulty, but some of us will devote time to nailing it
Not me, I think I did Survivor and haven't played it again. -
Let me phrase it this way.
If you went up to the 75% and asked if they would be ok with 2% of a game being geared towards the 25%, I would think the majority would say yes.
Now let's say you go to the 25% and say if they would be ok with 100% of the game being geared towards the 75%? I would think you'd have less than a majority saying yes.I'm not downplaying your frustration or how you feel about the moments. I get your argument. I'm saying asking that the 2% given to the 25% be removed is selfish/shortsighted for lack of a better term.
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Honest question...."what would you say is higher? Percentage of people saying they are too hard (especially Moments Xtreme and Story Lines) or percentage of people saying they love them because they like a challenge?"
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@FranchyzeMan said in Moments in 20:
Honest question...."what would you say is higher? Percentage of people saying they are too hard (especially Moments Xtreme and Story Lines) or percentage of people saying they love them because they like a challenge?"
Too hard obviously, but that doesn't prove they should be removed. You would have to make a case that those people that are saying it's "too hard" would quit and leave the franchise. They are designed so that the average person feels like they are "too hard", that's the entire point. SDS expects that.
Because for all the fuss they make, if they don't leave and the 25% is happy with the 2%, why should SDS change?
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@FranchyzeMan said in Moments in 20:
Honest question...."what would you say is higher? Percentage of people saying they are too hard (especially Moments Xtreme and Story Lines) or percentage of people saying they love them because they like a challenge?"
If we're talking percentages, I would say the percentage of people that don't care either way is probably higher than both?
Sorry, I'll stay out of it
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You're probably right Red_Ted.....just love this Franchise and have been so frustrated this year that it's even more personal in the thought of giving it up....thanks for the 3rd party outlook sir....
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The problem with removing Moments from the game at this point is that it would make it nearly impossible for offline players to hit hit the point total for the bosses every inning. They would need to replace those points with other offline content.
If they did that and went back to the grind that was immortals in '18 then I would skip the game. So they are damned if they do and damned if they don't.
I do feel like, with the exception of Moments extreme, that the Moments, in general, got easier as we got deeper into the year. This is coming from an offline player who plays 90% of his games on Veteran. I guess I am lucky in that I can look at them and say, "nope, I am skipping those because they don't look like fun" and that I don't have a compulsion to complete them all.
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I somewhat agree with the OP, not so much that moments shouldn’t be hard, but that they should be more fair. CPU pitchers should not be hitting/walking batters in single game moments, CPU fielders need to play to their actual attributes, good squared up (or next year’s equivalent) should always be a hit (in moments), etc. And please not more multi inning pitching/game moments where you can’t give up 1 run (since CPU home runs are completely random).
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I loved moments this year, much much better than mind numbing beat up the cpu on rookie to accumulate outrageous numbers of stats missions. I hope moments are back for 20!
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@FranchyzeMan said in Moments in 20:
My problem is that I am a completionist. I have no problem with a challenge or a grind but so many of these moments feel broken and frustrating.. also, the pitch speeds are higher and the pitchers avoid the strike zone like the plague most of the time....you hear everyone on here talking about beating moments extreme and such, but that might be like the top 25% of this game. What about the rest of us that are just average?
I'm not top 25%, but i finished the first ones. Didn't go back to finish the one with the Andrew Miller reward. The strikeout one is one i should have gotten, but the pitchers refused to throw strikes after the first pitcher. I forgot who it was.
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@GradektheBard said in Moments in 20:
good squared up (or next year’s equivalent) should always be a hit (in moments), etc.
I don't really agree with that. They should be hits far more often than they should be outs but they should not be a 100% guaranteed hit.
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I am not a completionist. There are Moments I grinned out for cards which would help me in Events (Rookie Chipper, Rookie Wagner, Future Star from the Reds, etc) and there are certain Moments I powered through to collect cards on my way to Honus (Juan Marichal, Griffey) but there were certain things I was never going to do...
I wasn't going to grind out the Babe Ruth Moments for a pitcher card lacking any horizontal movement on his pitches.
I wasn't going to grind out 20+ moments to get a gold Ben Zobrist when a diamond Zobrist was much easier to get (although having a silver, gold, and diamond switch hitting utility guy would have been ideal for events).
There was no way in Hades I was going to do all the Guidrey Moments to unlock a Vlad card which would sit on my bench as a right handed PH at best.
And there was no way in %^$$ I was going to grind Moments for a pack or even the 5,000 stubs represented in an original diamond choice pack.
