How is the Community Market feeling (7)
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Howdy,
This thread is dedicated exclusively to the health status of the Market, I want to hear if the measures are impacting and healing the in-game economy.
Do not post your App issues here, use the appropriate thread for that:
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M Manu__SDS_MLBTS pinned this topic
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Sorry I posted in the wrong thread. Please delete.
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Not everything but many cards that are known to have bots on them are being flooded with copies bringing it the price way down. Many high value cards are down 50-75%.
Edit: I see there’s a flash sale for vault packs - the drop in cards I saw though is hard to explain with that. Rare round St Patrick day cards went from selling at 33k suddenly to 8k. Other cards not even in vault pack dropped also.
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Thank you. I was hoping to get some feedback during the time the new filter was on, now it's turned off again; We'll see what happened at the next iteration.
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The market was performing very well with the new filter on. When I say well, I mean that you could place a bid and not be instantly outbid or undercut. Sometimes you would see a bidding war but if it’s something you really want and you put a ridiculous high bid, you will get it instead of being outbid by 1 stub no matter what. It’s lowkey demoralizing trying to compete against bots programmed to 1-up you. Also you can leave a bid and it would fill over time. Lately with bots I will leave bids and the next day see my bid has not been filled and the item keeps selling for 1 stub over my bid - meaning the bot just makes a new bid above mine after the previous bid goes through. I’m not an economist so I’m not sure the words to describe how the market is acting, but as a baseball video game player, I can say that when the filter is on, the market feels like something I can be a part of and get involved in, play around, try to strategize and speculate with… when no filter has been on it feels chaotic and that is be lucky to get the scraps from following around quickly moving prices and quantities. Especially when I see dozens of transactions at a price in the same minute but when I try to hop in the prices change to 1-up me. It feels like you see a game going on but can’t play it - which isn’t fun.
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When can I expect Ohtani prices to drop?
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I actually agree that the market looks much healthier with the filter enabled, and I think that's a good thing. However, I think there is an important distinction here that I'm still not seeing addressed.
A healthier market doesn't necessarily mean the filter is successfully distinguishing bots from legitimate players. It can also mean that legitimate players simply have fewer practical ways to participate in the Marketplace.
For example, I haven't flipped anything for about three days. After seeing your post, I decided to test the App myself by placing a single order on a common card. My very first order resulted in a 10-minute cooldown. If a legitimate player can go three days without using the Marketplace and then get a cooldown from their first order, I'm honestly not sure how we're supposed to use the App for normal flipping.
This also makes the alternatives important. On console, there is no Favorites feature, so manually flipping specific cards means constantly searching for them. The web version has already become less convenient for flipping compared with how it used to be because of the increased reCAPTCHA frequency. And now the App can put legitimate users into cooldowns after very little activity.
So if all three ways of accessing the Marketplace become more difficult, of course the market can look healthier. There are simply fewer people able to actively compete. Larger spreads and less aggressive competition are then an expected result.
I'm not saying the filter should simply be removed. I understand that you are trying to deal with bots and third-party sites. What I'm questioning is whether the current approach is actually separating bots from legitimate players, or just reducing Marketplace activity from both.
I also find it difficult to evaluate the long-term effect when the filter is repeatedly turned on and off after only a few hours. Every iteration changes the behavior of the entire market, so I'm not sure how meaningful a short-term comparison can be. If the goal is to find a sustainable solution, wouldn't it make more sense to leave a version enabled for a meaningful period and let the community use it normally before evaluating the results?
Most importantly, what level of Marketplace activity should a normal human flipper reasonably be able to perform without repeatedly receiving cooldowns?
Because that's ultimately what I'm trying to understand. I don't need to flip hundreds of cards per minute. I'm perfectly happy flipping manually every few minutes. But if even normal, occasional Marketplace activity can result in 10-minute cooldowns, then the App becomes very difficult to use for its intended purpose.
And if the App needs to have these restrictions, then I think the console Marketplace needs to become a much better alternative — especially with features like Favorites. Otherwise, you're essentially making every method of flipping more difficult and then using the resulting healthier market as evidence that the solution is working.
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After a few decent days the margins are all dead again. This has been the cycle for months now. It’s time to start issuing IP bans not just account bans so people can’t simply restart on an alt account and buy cheap stubs indefinitely. Shut them down permanently. Then go after the 3rd party stubs sites and shut them down for theft of intellectual property. This year has been an absolute disaster on many levels with the market being front and center. If this isn’t taken seriously beyond a “please play fair” and “3 year account ban” but feel free to just restart on an alt account and buy millions of stubs for dirt cheap further inflating the market then this game is toast. Not just this year but the franchise as a whole.
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8am pst 9/2 the market is feeling like a total sham. Many cards are on the lower end of their average price, making it look attractive to buyers/investors, but it’s a facade. For example, Fred McGriff vintage card - a reward from winning diamond quest - there is no reason this card should move away from its average 23-28k listing. The card can be minted by any player with 45 minutes anytime of the season. There are no new collections or motives to possess this card. It could be argued that PlayStation plus has new players getting and selling that card but there’s also new players buying that card to complete collections - either way, the card dipping down to 17k is the same pattern this card sees every few days. It’s very attractive at 17 but it’s a mirage - it’s unobtainable at 17k. It’s totally possible someone is watching and refreshing Fred mcgriff vintage bid sheet over and over and over and anytime a new buy bid is placed they are instantly outbidding by 1 stub. When you withdraw your bids, so does this other bidder(s). No matter what, they own the top bid. But it’s less likely a person when you start making bids of higher prices that get instantly outbid by 1 stub is when you start thinking that this free and fair marketplace is astroturfed. The outcome is completely controlled by outside forces. Waiting for the marketplace to be cleaned up so fair play can be restored has been exhausting. Many players are hanging on by a thread and then a new filter is turned on and fairness gets restored almost instantly. Thats no exaggeration, the numbers actually show this interference has been systematic and pervasive.
I get that adjustments need to be made to the latest filter and that some players are getting timeout on the app, including myself. But without that filter, the entire market is corrupted. Not to mention it’s being controlled by bad actors with intent to steal and profit. Pleaaaaase activate a filter that blocks these bots. If players run into problems in the short term while it gets sorted, so be it. I’m in that boat too. It’s game over for the market without blocking bots. -
Amen. On again off again bs gets old. Can’t even sell any cards right now without margin completely drying up. Can we please just turn off transactions on the app for good and make it console only?
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@TripleH-4481_PSN Agreed. The companion app really makes the market no useable. I have no issues making it console only.
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I mean clearly the stub transfer sites are still running rampant when we see activity like this in the Max Clark Pipeline card on Wednesday, at 10:25 PM PDT. 150 listed sell orders at the same price? Fishy to say the least. This is why the community market is broken
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This, but for some reason SDS will not get rid of the app and make it console only. Is that horrible mobile game tied into the app? Makes no sense, but a lot of what this company does is beyond dumb.
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I believe the app and the mobile game are two different entities.
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They absolutely are 2 different things. The app should be used for everything but transactions. Make those console only.
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It's a bit more tedious on the console but it's not horrible. I was at one point in the camp as you are but have since flipped my thinking on it. I was away for a couple weeks and of course couldn't use my console. I stayed engaged through the app, in particular the marketplace and silver to gold pack exchanges. If it weren't for that I would not have finished Beltran collections. It's about immersion. Everyone on this forum is immersed in this game one way or another. Taking a point of immersion out of the game is probably not what the game needs right now. There are other ways that I have been very vocal about to rid the bots and changing the ToS is a huge step in the right direction towards that.
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The market is feeling pretty predictable today. All signs show the fix is in - human players are still being taking advantage of. The fred mcgriff card I referenced yesterday is down to 14k right now, the lowest I’ve ever seen it. All bids are instantly beat though. When the human quits trying outbid the bot, 2 more bids get placed by the bot to ensure humans can’t obtain the card at the low price if someone sells off multiple dupes at the same time.
Im so confused with this attempt to reclaim fair play and a gameplay environment where everyone is free from bullying and toxic gameplay blah blah blah blah blah. If by some chance I witness toxic whatever’s or cheating something or others I should immediately report it? It will be taken seriously? This extends to the marketplace? Yes? If so, kindly turn on any filters that block bots from using the marketplace. It is understood some humans may have trouble using the app while some fine tuning is done, but they will still be able to use the marketplace like everyone else that is not a bot on the console. Probably the website as well. So there shouldn’t be any conflict of providing an unfair gameplay experience to those jammed up with the app while settings get adjusted. Fair play. Anyone? Come on. -
Hi Guys, I’m new to flipping. Could someone explain to me why the app contributes to the overall bot/markeplace problem and why making transactions via console only is a solution? I’ve had success this season with the app although not very much the past few weeks. Flipping IMO is a necessary part of the game especially with the outrageous prices of some cards and transactional speed has at least given me a fighting chance. Thanks
