Ohtani's "Greatest Season Ever"
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@dbarmonstar_psn said in Ohtani's "Greatest Season Ever":
@quinnymcquinn said in Ohtani's "Greatest Season Ever":
@kdclemson_psn said in Ohtani's "Greatest Season Ever":
@quinnymcquinn said in Ohtani's "Greatest Season Ever":
do yourself a favor watch the games. No one is doing what Otani is doing. And if Otani can do this for a few years he’ll surpass Babe as the best two way player ever.
I’m not saying Otani is having a better season than Ruth ever had. I’m just saying Otani is having one of the greatest seasons of all time. And even if it’s 130th in WAR that’s pretty darn good. I’d argue that there’s a precedence here set by Otani being a great if not the greatest two way player the game has ever seen. That has implications far greater than stats.
That’s where your bias comes from, if you would’ve had the chance to watch Babe, this wouldn’t even be an argument. You just want the guy you got to see to be the greatest.
“Nobody has done what Ohtani has done”. Ohtani plays baseball, 130 guys have had better seasons.
No one has done what Otani has done. And in sports that’s what makes you great. Hence one of the greatest seasons ever. Which brings me to my initial call out of you comparing the best to the greatest. See how that works?
Saying Otani is having one of the greatest season ever because he is pitching and hitting because no one else does it. He is not the best player on the Angels, HR and RBI are the only numbers that stand out as a hitter, he is hitting below .270 not so great, his era 3.00, before the season is over he will probably strike out over 200 times not so great. The not so great is IMO. Is he having a great season because of the HR and RBI sure, that will probably win him the MVP, IMO he is not having one of the greatest season of all time, I do not even think it is close, IF his ERA was in the low 2's and he was hitting around .300 that would be elite but he is not. He is better than avg pitcher and a avg hitter with great power. If Ohtani was playing in the 1920's his career would not have lasted a year due to injuries. Ruth would still be good in today game with the equipment they use now, Maybe not the greatest but he would still be good because he would have been brought up in today's game. Ruth changed the Power game. IMO Ty Cobb is the greatest player of all time.
Good until the last sentence
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Ichiro has had the greatest season ever as a player from Japan and or Asia his 2001 rookie year and 2004. Matsui 2005, Nomo rookie year 1995 and 1996 were great as well.
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@kdclemson_psn said in Ohtani's "Greatest Season Ever":
@dbarmonstar_psn said in Ohtani's "Greatest Season Ever":
@quinnymcquinn said in Ohtani's "Greatest Season Ever":
@kdclemson_psn said in Ohtani's "Greatest Season Ever":
@quinnymcquinn said in Ohtani's "Greatest Season Ever":
do yourself a favor watch the games. No one is doing what Otani is doing. And if Otani can do this for a few years he’ll surpass Babe as the best two way player ever.
I’m not saying Otani is having a better season than Ruth ever had. I’m just saying Otani is having one of the greatest seasons of all time. And even if it’s 130th in WAR that’s pretty darn good. I’d argue that there’s a precedence here set by Otani being a great if not the greatest two way player the game has ever seen. That has implications far greater than stats.
That’s where your bias comes from, if you would’ve had the chance to watch Babe, this wouldn’t even be an argument. You just want the guy you got to see to be the greatest.
“Nobody has done what Ohtani has done”. Ohtani plays baseball, 130 guys have had better seasons.
No one has done what Otani has done. And in sports that’s what makes you great. Hence one of the greatest seasons ever. Which brings me to my initial call out of you comparing the best to the greatest. See how that works?
Saying Otani is having one of the greatest season ever because he is pitching and hitting because no one else does it. He is not the best player on the Angels, HR and RBI are the only numbers that stand out as a hitter, he is hitting below .270 not so great, his era 3.00, before the season is over he will probably strike out over 200 times not so great. The not so great is IMO. Is he having a great season because of the HR and RBI sure, that will probably win him the MVP, IMO he is not having one of the greatest season of all time, I do not even think it is close, IF his ERA was in the low 2's and he was hitting around .300 that would be elite but he is not. He is better than avg pitcher and a avg hitter with great power. If Ohtani was playing in the 1920's his career would not have lasted a year due to injuries. Ruth would still be good in today game with the equipment they use now, Maybe not the greatest but he would still be good because he would have been brought up in today's game. Ruth changed the Power game. IMO Ty Cobb is the greatest player of all time.
Good until the last sentence
I am a dodger fan, Everyone has there opinion
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Ohtani is not facing great pitching in the AL especially in the west.
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@kdclemson_psn said in Ohtani's "Greatest Season Ever":
@chuckclc_psn said in Ohtani's "Greatest Season Ever":
Lets not pretend WAR is the end all be all of evaluating a player. How well did Babe pitch in those seasons? Babe definitely has the most impressive hitting numbers of all time, but when you add in Pitching and Speed it does become a legit argument between the 2.
Plus of course the obvious 100 hundred year difference in athletic era. Apples and Oranges.
Between hitting, pitching and speed.
Babe was miles better hitting, miles better pitching, and slightly worse if that in speed.This is so bad
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To say Ruth hit off bad pitching is incorrect, The pitching back then was better than it is today. Team ERA in 1920 only 5 teams were over 4 and 1 team over 5. 5 teams under 3 the best team ERA in 1920 was 2.32. Some of the teams only played 50 plus games, Games played varied 16 teams played 154 or 155. The other 6 were from 60-124 Games played. If Ruth was hitting of Janitors that is some pretty good Janitors he was hitting off of. Why was Ruth the only one hitting with power if the pitching was so bad. That is without all the knowledge the pitchers have today.
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Othani is a good player. He isn’t even close to the best player on his team.
Trout
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@johnutah312_xbl said in Ohtani's "Greatest Season Ever":
Othani is a good player. He isn’t even close to the best player on his team.
Trout
To be fair trout is still miles behind Ruth
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@kdclemson_psn said in Ohtani's "Greatest Season Ever":
@johnutah312_xbl said in Ohtani's "Greatest Season Ever":
Othani is a good player. He isn’t even close to the best player on his team.
Trout
To be fair trout is still miles behind Ruth
How would you know? One you never saw, and the other if he’s not playing the NYY you probably never saw either. Going by your Jeter comments, any and all arguments about baseball you make are invalid. Not to mention your ability to hit MLB pitching…
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@yankblan_psn said in Ohtani's "Greatest Season Ever":
@kdclemson_psn said in Ohtani's "Greatest Season Ever":
@johnutah312_xbl said in Ohtani's "Greatest Season Ever":
Othani is a good player. He isn’t even close to the best player on his team.
Trout
To be fair trout is still miles behind Ruth
How would you know? One you never saw, and the other if he’s not playing the NYY you probably never saw either. Going by your Jeter comments, any and all arguments about baseball you make are invalid. Not to mention your ability to hit MLB pitching…
How would I know? Because I can read stats
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Kieran still out here baiting people
Oh he's so mature, he's going to college now! So you know he's all grown up and mature being a college freshman. Still out here baiting, same old Kieran.
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@kdclemson_psn said in Ohtani's "Greatest Season Ever":
@yankblan_psn said in Ohtani's "Greatest Season Ever":
@kdclemson_psn said in Ohtani's "Greatest Season Ever":
@johnutah312_xbl said in Ohtani's "Greatest Season Ever":
Othani is a good player. He isn’t even close to the best player on his team.
Trout
To be fair trout is still miles behind Ruth
How would you know? One you never saw, and the other if he’s not playing the NYY you probably never saw either. Going by your Jeter comments, any and all arguments about baseball you make are invalid. Not to mention your ability to hit MLB pitching…
How would I know? Because I can read stats
And like so many have pointed to you, to no avail because you’re an all time stubborn know-it-all still wet behind the ears, the stat comparisons are flawed.
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@raesone_psn said in Ohtani's "Greatest Season Ever":
Kieran still out here baiting people
Oh he's so mature, he's going to college now! So you know he's all grown up and mature being a college freshman. Still out here baiting, same old Kieran.
I took the bait earlier this year. It’s truly insufferable now.
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I mentioned it in another thread, but Ruth is 16th all time in H/9 as a pitcher. He is also 17th in career ERA, 16th in W/L%, 13th in HR/9 allowed, and is top 100 career in many pitching stats. He had a pitching WAR of 8.8 in a season. So many of you seem to think like "oh yeah, he also pitched some. That's cute". He was the best LHP in baseball for a 2-3 year stretch. You all completely downplay his abilities as a pitcher.
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@raesone_psn said in Ohtani's "Greatest Season Ever":
Kieran still out here baiting people
Oh he's so mature, he's going to college now! So you know he's all grown up and mature being a college freshman. Still out here baiting, same old Kieran.
It’s not bait it’s stats buddy
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It doesn’t matter because the OP is making comparisons where comparisons can’t be made. Ruth came up during the dead ball era and Ohtani plays in the modern era. You cannot make a comparison between the two. So anything that is said can only be subjective. The OP’s opinion is that Ohtani is not having one of the greatest seasons ever. That’s all it is, an opinion. Please stop acting as if it’s not an opinion because it is. There is no factual basis to make the argument that he’s not having one of the greatest seasons ever because your stats are being pulled from different eras of baseball history.
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P.S. This is the same guy that says he could hit major league pitching so consider the source when you argue with this guy.
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@KILLERPRESENCE4
Haha forgot about that post. Thanks for the laugh, that was indeed a good one -
@kdclemson_psn said in Ohtani's "Greatest Season Ever":
@misfits_138_1_psn said in Ohtani's "Greatest Season Ever":
@dewrock_psn said in Ohtani's "Greatest Season Ever":
@go4stros25_psn said in Ohtani's "Greatest Season Ever":
Lol yankee fans "but but babe Ruth, but but but in 1920...."
Babe Ruth played 20 years before Jackie Robison broke the color barrier. The talent in the league today is unreal. Might be baseball blasphemy, but I wouldn't be shocked if babe Ruth was just a run of the mill DH in today's game.
Athletes in every sport have gotten bigger, stronger, and faster since we started tracking these things. Why would mlb pitchers be any different? I know there were probably a few guys back them that could probably hit the low 90s, but call me crazy. I just don't think the average pitcher, Whitey Willabe McGroover, fresh off the farm was bringing a 97+ to the plate like the majority of pitchers are today.
Ruth was the best of his time. He has left behind one of, if not the biggest, legacies in professional sports. That's his place. Can't compare players 100 years apart
And yet we have stats that do just that.
Think of how sick Ruth, Cobb, and the early greats would have been if they knew about the benefits of good nutrition, weight training, had video access to every pitcher and all of their at bats, and didn't have to get jobs in the off season?
Also, the health concerns of alcohol and tobacco use, and poor diet.
Remember, weight training was taboo in all sports expect football until the late 80's.
I think those guys would be just fine playing today.The thing is a lot of principals of modern swing mechanics come from Ruth too, his stance looked weird but a lot of the weight shifting and techniques along with it were decades ahead of its time
Is that why the put the fatso’s waddle in the game? It was just ahead of its time making him only slightly slower than Ohtani.
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Really hard to compare players over 100 years apart. The level of competition was nowhere near what it is today. If they matched up head to head today, Ruth might have a hard time hitting Ohtani, and Ohtani would likely bomb off of Ruth’s pitching.
