The Cleveland Baseball Team....
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@The_DoctorsWife said in The Cleveland Baseball Team....:
@Kuhlkilla said in The Cleveland Baseball Team....:
@The_DoctorsWife said in The Cleveland Baseball Team....:
@TheGoaler said in The Cleveland Baseball Team....:
.....just seems weird. The new name should be revealed this week.
I hate the name change. It just doesn’t feel right to have the team be called the same thing for a hundred years or so and then suddenly have it called something else.
My main qualm is that this decision is being made for the Native Americans. Historically, they’ve constantly had decisions made for them by anyone other than themselves (not going to go into a history lecture but hopefully you get what I’m referring to). Honestly, if I were a Native American, I would feel offended if something was changed “for my sake” without my opinion whatsoever, and I would especially be tired of others feeling sorry for me. The Navajo were interviewed about whether or not they found the Washington football team’s name & mascot offensive, and a lot of them actually thought it was a cool celebration and admiration of their culture.
I think it should be like this: Leave it up to Native Americans to decide whether they want these team names changed or not.
Nuff said.
I would recommend checking out the owner's statement on this because he does refer to some of the items you point out. He says that they have been talking with tons of Native American groups and organization, especially in the Ohio area, about the name and their opinion on it. In the end I think you would agree with the name change based on your comments regarding the situation, due to the Native American organizations preferring a name change be made.
And I am not trying to imply that you do, or do not, agree with the name change. Just wanted to add to your opinion and hopefully others agree with you and will look into the research they have done as well.
I do agree that the Washington owner is a piece of garbage, he can’t clean up his disaster of a team. Just a disgrace to football imo.
The Chief Wahoo logo being offensive, that I can understand, and I’m fine with that being gone. But I just think changing the Cleveland name entirely might be going too far. Is there a possible team name that might be Native American-inspired, but still respects that heritage (and something that Native Americans would approve of)?
I just don’t like the idea of changing the name based on a revisionist history standpoint. This may be going off on a tangent or something, but I think that covering up the past (whether it be team names or actual history) because of its alleged offensiveness can be harmful if it’s done too much or in the wrong way. I just think it’s something that everyone should be aware and careful of.
We don't need a racist team name to remind us of Native Americans.
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@The_DoctorsWife said in The Cleveland Baseball Team....:
@Kuhlkilla said in The Cleveland Baseball Team....:
@The_DoctorsWife said in The Cleveland Baseball Team....:
@TheGoaler said in The Cleveland Baseball Team....:
.....just seems weird. The new name should be revealed this week.
I hate the name change. It just doesn’t feel right to have the team be called the same thing for a hundred years or so and then suddenly have it called something else.
My main qualm is that this decision is being made for the Native Americans. Historically, they’ve constantly had decisions made for them by anyone other than themselves (not going to go into a history lecture but hopefully you get what I’m referring to). Honestly, if I were a Native American, I would feel offended if something was changed “for my sake” without my opinion whatsoever, and I would especially be tired of others feeling sorry for me. The Navajo were interviewed about whether or not they found the Washington football team’s name & mascot offensive, and a lot of them actually thought it was a cool celebration and admiration of their culture.
I think it should be like this: Leave it up to Native Americans to decide whether they want these team names changed or not.
Nuff said.
I would recommend checking out the owner's statement on this because he does refer to some of the items you point out. He says that they have been talking with tons of Native American groups and organization, especially in the Ohio area, about the name and their opinion on it. In the end I think you would agree with the name change based on your comments regarding the situation, due to the Native American organizations preferring a name change be made.
And I am not trying to imply that you do, or do not, agree with the name change. Just wanted to add to your opinion and hopefully others agree with you and will look into the research they have done as well.
I do agree that the Washington owner is a piece of garbage, he can’t clean up his disaster of a team. Just a disgrace to football imo.
The Chief Wahoo logo being offensive, that I can understand, and I’m fine with that being gone. But I just think changing the Cleveland name entirely might be going too far. Is there a possible team name that might be Native American-inspired, but still respects that heritage (and something that Native Americans would approve of)?
I just don’t like the idea of changing the name based on a revisionist history standpoint. This may be going off on a tangent or something, but I think that covering up the past (whether it be team names or actual history) because of its alleged offensiveness can be harmful if it’s done too much or in the wrong way. I just think it’s something that everyone should be aware and careful of.
Landmark changes throughout history have been seen as “going too far” until decades later when that society understands the value of that change.
Emancipation - was seen as radical at that time. Women voting - was seen as radical at that time. Ending segregation - was seen as radical at that time. While slavery and suffrage were changed, it is still very much recognized in history and teaches important lessons.
Making changes does not revise history; it makes history.
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@The_DoctorsWife said in The Cleveland Baseball Team....:
Is there a possible team name that might be Native American-inspired, but still respects that heritage (and something that Native Americans would approve of)?
There are plenty out there already. Braves, Chiefs, Seminoles ect. But calling them a nationality on the other side of the Planet just because we were stupid enough to call them that in the first place is pretty absurd. The only thing worse is taking 100 hundred years to figure out maybe you shouldnt call a sports team by a name that is factually not even close. Just because some idiots call you Indians for hundreds of years doesnt mean you are Indian. It means those people are dumb.
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The Chicago Blackhawks work with Native American tribes to help educate the public. It can be done and IS done!!
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@ChuckCLC said in The Cleveland Baseball Team....:
@The_DoctorsWife said in The Cleveland Baseball Team....:
Is there a possible team name that might be Native American-inspired, but still respects that heritage (and something that Native Americans would approve of)?
There are plenty out there already. Braves, Chiefs, Seminoles ect. But calling them a nationality on the other side of the Planet just because we were stupid enough to call them that in the first place is pretty absurd. The only thing worse is taking 100 hundred years to figure out maybe you shouldnt call a sports team by a name that is factually not even close. Just because some idiots call you Indians for hundreds of years doesnt mean you are Indian. It means those people are dumb.
I think Columbus is to blame for that longtime misconception. He thought he was in India when he landed in the Bahamas, so he called them Indians. It’s unfortunate that it stuck.
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@TheGoaler said in The Cleveland Baseball Team....:
'Rockers' sounds cool, until your pitchers get rocked!
John Rocker agrees.
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@Kuhlkilla said in The Cleveland Baseball Team....:
@bostondirtdog21 said in The Cleveland Baseball Team....:
Someone on twitter suggested “Tribe”. That’s my vote.
The owner ruled out "Tribe". He said, and I am paraphrasing, "if we move away from something like Indians, we won't stop short at Tribe, which is closely related to what we had before."
Sadly Tribe won't be the next name for them.
Exactly Tribe doesn't "change" anything.
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How about the Cleveland Jobus?
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The thing I never understand is all the time companies and other things change names and style and everything but its only when racist symbols get changed that people seem to get upset.
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@mjfc_363 said in The Cleveland Baseball Team....:
The Chicago Blackhawks work with Native American tribes to help educate the public. It can be done and IS done!!
Bingo. The ACC Network did a great show about how the Seminole nation is honored to have FSU represent them and use their name.
Being racist is egregious but so is a group of people telling another group of people what is best for them or that their way is better.
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How bout Cuyahoga Chiefs in honor of the native land very near Cleveland?!
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@Kovz88 said in The Cleveland Baseball Team....:
The thing I never understand is all the time companies and other things change names and style and everything but its only when racist symbols get changed that people seem to get upset.
It’s so true. Some of the most toxic, asenine things are upheld for far longer than they should under the guise of “tradition”.
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@Kovz88 said in The Cleveland Baseball Team....:
The thing I never understand is all the time companies and other things change names and style and everything but its only when racist symbols get changed that people seem to get upset.
Um...... I don't think people have the same connection or investment in companies or products like they do with Sports teams generally speaking. Certainly you see a difference here.
I haven't watched 162 Captain Crunch commercials every year since I was a kid. I also don't have a jersey of their CEO, mvp of sales, or top factory worker from the 2014 season.
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@NCStateHokie said in The Cleveland Baseball Team....:
@Kovz88 said in The Cleveland Baseball Team....:
I haven't watched 162 Captain Crunch commercials every year since I was a kid. I also don't have a jersey of their CEO, mvp of sales, or top factory worker from the 2014 season.
Funniest thing I’ve read on here in a while
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@NCStateHokie said in The Cleveland Baseball Team....:
@mjfc_363 said in The Cleveland Baseball Team....:
The Chicago Blackhawks work with Native American tribes to help educate the public. It can be done and IS done!!
Bingo. The ACC Network did a great show about how the Seminole nation is honored to have FSU represent them and use their name.
Being racist is egregious but so is a group of people telling another group of people what is best for them or that their way is better.
EXACTLY. This is what I was trying to say in my earlier posts. People who are not Native American deciding what is best for Native Americans is the same thing as, for example, Andrew Jackson deciding what was best for them way back when.
Reservations and Trail of Tears, anyone?
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@NCStateHokie said in The Cleveland Baseball Team....:
@Kovz88 said in The Cleveland Baseball Team....:
The thing I never understand is all the time companies and other things change names and style and everything but its only when racist symbols get changed that people seem to get upset.
Um...... I don't think people have the same connection or investment in companies or products like they do with Sports teams generally speaking. Certainly you see a difference here.
I haven't watched 162 Captain Crunch commercials every year since I was a kid. I also don't have a jersey of their CEO, mvp of sales, or top factory worker from the 2014 season.
Exactly, people don't have huge connections with companies yet people still lost their mind when Aunt Jemima was changed. Thats what I was referencing. I'm totally down with teams and groups working together to come up with a respectful team name/mascot. Its just embarrassing how fast everyone tries to point out why something isn't offensive when it's been called offensive by the people it represents for a long time.
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@mjfc_363 said in The Cleveland Baseball Team....:
How bout Cuyahoga Chiefs in honor of the native land very near Cleveland?!
Lol... no thx
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New name = Cleveland_______ Presented by Progressive
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@lazy_toast said in The Cleveland Baseball Team....:
New name = Cleveland_______ Presented by Progressive
Cleveland Callers 'we've been trying to reach you about your cars extended warranty'
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@Kovz88 said in The Cleveland Baseball Team....:
@NCStateHokie said in The Cleveland Baseball Team....:
@Kovz88 said in The Cleveland Baseball Team....:
The thing I never understand is all the time companies and other things change names and style and everything but its only when racist symbols get changed that people seem to get upset.
Um...... I don't think people have the same connection or investment in companies or products like they do with Sports teams generally speaking. Certainly you see a difference here.
I haven't watched 162 Captain Crunch commercials every year since I was a kid. I also don't have a jersey of their CEO, mvp of sales, or top factory worker from the 2014 season.
Exactly, people don't have huge connections with companies yet people still lost their mind when Aunt Jemima was changed. Thats what I was referencing. I'm totally down with teams and groups working together to come up with a respectful team name/mascot. Its just embarrassing how fast everyone tries to point out why something isn't offensive when it's been called offensive by the people it represents for a long time.
Speaking of Aunt Jemima it is another example of what The_Doctors Wife was saying. White folks telling other races what is best for them or what should or shouldn't offend them. Here is a quote from one of Aunt Jemima's descendents. They were not happy about changing the product's name.
"This woman served all those people, and it was after slavery," he said. "She worked as Aunt Jemima. That was her job. … How do you think I feel as a black man sitting here telling you about my family history they're trying to erase?"
