Youtubers are all going in
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@Bridge-Piece_XBL EXCUSE ME SIR? YOU ACTUALLY LIKE THIS GAME? YOU MUST BE A SLOP ENJOYER. GET BETTER!
Iโve been called much worse for enjoying the game
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Okay, Iโll bite. A walk isnโt as good as a hit? Explain. I first heard that expression when I was in Little League which was well before the dawn of sabermetrics.
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Rickey Henderson and Lou Brock thought about hitting first then getting on base first
Lou Brock maybe but Rickey is #2 all time in walks, it was a huge part of his game. Guys like Rickey and Boggs are where the Moneyball concept comes from. Boggs used to be criticized by some for his walks
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Boggs openly says he doesn't like sabermetrics. When you hit the ball decent players go from first to third, even if you hit it in play towards a fielder they need to make a play on it, good things happen when the ball is in play. A walk is the ultimate sister kisser. I never said walks were pointless, I said hits are better than walks and walks are boring. I stand by that. and to say that maney ball comes from rickey is completely out of left field, Ricky stole, rickey put the ball in play with less than two outs to score runs, rickey didn;t swing for the fences when a single would do.
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Launch Angle & Exit Velocity are not technically sabernetrics which uses box score statistics as their foundation. They are Statcast Analytics but I understand what you mean. Iโm 58 years old and never got much into sabernetrics but I think Rickey Henderson and not Don Mattingly should have won the AL MVP in 1985 and sabernetrics proved this to me and a lot of people of my generation who just felt it to be true simply through observation. Don Mattingly had the eye catching traditional stats like RBI that always rated extremely highly with the voters. Case closed. Now, that being said, Rickeyโs job was to get on base, get into scoring position and get home. Donnieโs was to drive him home. I view sabernetrics as just another tool in the toolbelt. Moneyball was an interesting read but the movie took a lot of dramatic license. I know in my heart that there is such a thing as being clutch which sabernetrics dismisses as chance and sometimes a bunt or a steal is absolutely vital. I still believe, however, that a walk is absolutely as good as a hit but Donnie was of the mindset that I need to get this guy home and a walk would only do that with the bases loaded.
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It's right to call out SDS, especially the Finest drop.
No Finest collection, oh if you collect 55 of them you get 1/32 of Elly. Making the packs all choice packs, so Deluxe packs mean nothing. We did get some really good free cards, but man, the drop was bad.
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It's right to call out SDS, especially the Finest drop.
No Finest collection, oh if you collect 55 of them you get 1/32 of Elly. Making the packs all choice packs, so Deluxe packs mean nothing. We did get some really good free cards, but man, the drop was bad.
I found out the painfully hard way. Didn't see the fine print that said this only gets you 1 voucher. Ouch. My only saving grace is the P5 94 Spotlight Elly is still great, and it's November!
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It's right to call out SDS, especially the Finest drop.
No Finest collection, oh if you collect 55 of them you get 1/32 of Elly. Making the packs all choice packs, so Deluxe packs mean nothing. We did get some really good free cards, but man, the drop was bad.
I found out the painfully hard way. Didn't see the fine print that said this only gets you 1 voucher. Ouch. My only saving grace is the P5 94 Spotlight Elly is still great, and it's November!
There is also no excuse for what they did to the Reds and Mets, with no easily available Finest
Surely a Brock Burke and Christian Scott could have been added somewhere?
No TA, or similar style content, means no Show for me next year.
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Iโve been firing up older versions of the game and actually enjoying my time. Think Iโm leaning very heavily towards skipping next year and if no serious changes happen Iโm done for good.
On another note. When did they change the CPU pitching to the super dot bs of the past couple years? I was playing 24 and it seemed significantly more enjoyable. Was 25 when they butchered hittable pitches?
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Was 25 when they butchered hittable pitches?
I think so. In a recent mini-season game, on All-Star, I walked 11 times. Pre-2025, I'd be lucky to walk once in a 9 inning game.
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Yeah playing 24 was night and day. Iโve also got 21, 22 and 23 I can play so Iโm gonna enjoy those for my baseball fix.
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'25 was annoying with the dots but this year it's on a whole different level of annoying.
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Agreed. I popped back in 25 and although bad it was nowhere near as bad as 26. 24 was actually a pleasant surprise. Looking forward to trying out 23, 22 and 21 again.
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Okay, Iโll bite. A walk isnโt as good as a hit? Explain. I first heard that expression when I was in Little League which was well before the dawn of sabermetrics.
A walk will not score a runner in scoring position unless the bases are loaded, and even then, only scores one run, not two on a single. Of course, like with everything else in baseball, it's all about context, the exact nature of the hit, and the quality of the defensive fielding and your own base running.
But, a walk is certainly as good as a single when the bases are empty, and with a runner on first.
However, there can be a definite context where a walk can actually work better than a single -- driving up pitch count. If a string of batters force deep counts to earn walks, it can put a pitcher into a severely fatigued state with runners on first and second, increasing the odds of a mistake getting hammered for a multi-base hit.
Baseball is beautiful because of the complexity of how plays can materialize. The odds can be measured, but never guaranteed. There are no absolutes in baseball, only events that play out uniquely.
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Exactly. All of this.
But the idea of a single being better than a walk is actually already accounted for by sabremetrics. OPS (on base percentage plus slugging percentage) became a mainstream stat because of sabremetrics. The basic runs created formula is times on base plus total bases divided by plate appearances (or something to that effect). A single increases the numerator in that expression by two (one for getting on base and another for the total base). While a walk doesnโt produce a total base at all (only half as good as a single).
No sabremetrician is saying that walks are better than singles (with maybe the exception of pitch counts), but rather that walks had been overlooked as an accomplishment by batters (walks were often merely interpreted as a lucky bonus from a wild pitcher).
Now weโre talking about a video game. Of course walks and high pitch counts are boring. And yes, when the three outcomes of walks, strikeouts and homers are too prevalent, I understand @victoryphoenix_mlbts saying that itโs boring. But Iโm not sure if SDSโs devotion to sabremetrics is the reason for this.
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Itโs not that, itโs the terrible hitting engine and undersized playing field that makes anything but a HR or walk a high probability for an out. Fielders cover way too much ground killing doubles and all but eliminating triples. If they made the playing field bigger and scaled fielders back more hit variety would come back. The change is long overdue.
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@PriorFir4383355_XBLI'll let this go, but before we move on, here is my formal dissertationโcomplete with empirical proofโon why a base hit blows a walk out of the water in every meaningful game state:
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Nobody on base
This is the only scenario where a walk is even remotely comparable to a single. Even then, a hit puts pressure on the defense and gives you a shot at extra bases. -
Runner on first
A hit advances the runner at least to second base, and often first-to-third. Even a slow runner moving to second is now in scoring position. If they make it to third, the ways you can score (sac fly, wild pitch, groundout, passed ball) multiply exponentially. With a walk, the runner only moves to secondโmeaning you still need a hit to bring them home. -
Runners on second and third
A base hit almost always scores one run, and frequently clears both bases for two. A walk loads the bases and scores zero. -
Bases loaded
A solid hit almost always scores two runsโand if itโs a double, youโre likely clearing the bases for three. A walk forces in a single run and puts the crowd to sleep.
Bonus: When an out is actually better than a walk
With a runner on third and fewer than two outs, a deep fly ball (sacrifice fly) or a productive groundout drives in the run. A walk just clogs the bases and keeps the run stranded at third.In analytics, they call it RE24 (Run Expectancy)โand the math backs up the eye test. A walk only moves runners one base at a time, whereas a hit unlocks extra bases, forces defensive mistakes, and actually cashes in runs. Case closed
Runner on third less than 2 outs, a ground ball to the middle of the infield or a slow roller or buntm get that run in, a walk just gets you a runner on base with no run scored. Or A flyball deep enough to the outfield get the run scored.These are just a few scenarios where a hit is better than a walk, also a hit depends on your skill and a walk depends on the pitcher not throwing strikes.
By far the m ost under rated stat in the game is batting average with runners on base... I would suggest that you listen to Will Clark's podcast, or check out Brooke knows ball.... Both are advocates for a return to less analytics more fundamentals. Truly the onlt wasted out is a strike out. and a walk is something you take, not something you go up there looking to do. Baseball can be an exciting sport if we allow it to be.
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I sometimes feel that the game should be called PRIMAL BASEBALL because of the prevalence of homers, strikeouts, walks (to some extent,) stolen bases and spectacular defensive play. Nolan Ryan is pitching to Dave Kingman who morphs into Lou Brock when he reaches base and the fielders are all Ozzie Smith, Willie Mays & Johnny Bench types. Ha ha. Thatโs what a lot of games feel like to me especially when challenging yourself on a higher difficulty.
P.S. Feel free to insert the names of players from your generation. -
Excellent analysis, Gentlemen. What Iโm gathering here is that itโs all about context and a walk is roughly the same as a hit with no runners in scoring position but overall not as valuable as a hit which has more potential to advance runners which ultimately creates runs. Am I on the right track? Also, wasnโt sabernetrics trying to convey that not making outs is paramount and maybe this somehow fused into the old adage about walks being as good as hits? By the way, if Iโm ever on a game show, expect a request to be a lifeline.
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I wonder what Ted Williams would say about the notion that walks are not important
