Neon Position Players Ranked - Let's debate
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So here are the best Neon players as ranked by my program. For those who don't know it uses Offense, defense and running. I will also admit that since it uses the same formula for all players that it is a little unfair to slower players like catchers.
I am not a fan of Bryan Reynolds being ahead of Gehrig or Mays. I think the only reason he ranks ahead of Gehrig are the Fielding and Running attributes
Maybe I should have it come up with purely a hitting meta score.
Contact (Avg R/L) - 20%
Power (Avg R/L) - 20%
Clutch - 15%
Speed - 10%
Fielding - 10%
Reaction - 10%
Vis - 5%
Disc - 5%
Arm Strength - 5%OVR Meta Player 99 105 Bryan Reynolds 99 104.1 Lou Gehrig 99 103.3 Willie Mays 99 103.1 Bobby Abreu 99 102.6 Derek Jeter 99 100.9 Konnor Griffin 99 100.7 JJ Wetherholt 99 100.7 Travis Bazzana 99 100.3 Lance Berkman 99 100.25 Jesús Made 99 100 Adrian Beltre 99 99.45 Walker Jenkins 99 98.85 Jackson Merrill 99 98.75 Rafael Palmeiro 99 98.45 Ozzie Albies 99 98.25 Chandler Simpson 99 98.25 Geraldo Perdomo 99 98.15 Colt Emerson 99 97.85 Curtis Granderson 99 97.6 Shawn Green 99 97.35 Marcelo Mayer 99 96.8 Logan O'Hoppe 99 96.6 Kyle Teel 99 96.4 Adley Rutschman 99 96.15 Kevin McGonigle 99 96.1 Charlie Condon 99 95.25 Tyler Soderstrom 99 95.15 Anthony Rizzo 99 93.6 Jac Caglianone -
Simpson has been a stud in my speed/bunt team
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I got everyone to P1, below is some stats for each of the hitters. All of the stats came from Conquest with most on Veteran and a few games on Rookie. Of course players did face different pitchers and at different stadiums with different wind conditions. I ranked them by how much PXP per PA which I think shows how "productive" they were since PXP has its own scale of productivity. It would be easier to read in a spreadsheet.
Player PXP/PA PXP PA BA AB H HR XBH SLG OPS ISO PWR Factor TPQ
- Kevin McGonigle 72.875 583 8 0.750 8 6 3 5 2.125 2.875 1.375 2.833 3.250
- Lou Gehrig 72.286 506 7 0.571 7 4 4 4 2.286 2.857 1.714 4.000 3.571
- Shawn Green 69.222 623 9 0.750 8 6 4 5 2.375 3.153 1.625 3.167 3.500
- JJ Wetherholt 65.500 524 8 0.625 8 5 3 5 2.000 2.625 1.375 3.200 2.750
- Rafael Palmeiro 64.889 584 9 0.556 9 5 4 5 2.000 2.556 1.444 3.600 3.222
- Bryan Reynolds 63.556 572 9 0.556 9 5 3 4 1.667 2.222 1.111 3.000 2.444
- Jackson Merrill 60.667 546 9 0.778 9 7 2 5 1.778 2.556 1.000 2.286 2.333
- Bobby Abreu 59.778 538 9 0.500 8 4 3 1 1.750 2.306 1.250 3.500 2.625
- Konnor Griffin 59.444 535 9 0.556 9 5 1 3 1.222 1.778 0.667 2.200 1.556
- Willie Mays 59.364 653 11 0.600 10 6 2 4 1.400 2.036 0.800 2.333 2.200
- Travis Bazzana 58.222 524 9 0.556 9 5 3 3 1.556 2.111 1.000 2.800 2.444
- Charlie Condon 57.200 572 10 0.778 9 7 2 3 1.556 2.356 0.778 2.000 2.556
- Chandler Simpson 56.222 506 9 0.444 9 4 1 4 1.222 1.667 0.778 2.750 1.778
- Tyler Soderstrom 56.000 504 9 0.571 7 4 2 3 1.571 2.127 1.000 2.750 2.571
- Walker Jenkins 55.000 605 11 0.333 9 3 2 3 1.111 1.556 0.778 3.333 1.889
- Logan O'Hoppe 54.909 604 11 0.545 11 6 2 4 1.273 1.818 0.727 2.333 2.091
- Marcelo Mayer 54.900 549 10 0.667 9 6 2 3 1.556 2.156 0.889 2.333 2.111
- Colt Emerson 53.900 539 10 0.500 10 5 2 4 1.300 1.800 0.800 2.600 1.800
- Anthony Rizzo 53.818 592 11 0.556 9 5 2 3 1.333 1.879 0.778 2.400 2.111
- Geraldo Perdomo 52.636 579 11 0.400 10 4 3 4 1.400 1.764 1.000 3.500 2.200
- Derek Jeter 51.417 617 12 0.364 11 4 2 3 1.000 1.333 0.636 2.750 1.727
- Kyle Teel 51.000 510 10 0.600 10 6 1 3 1.100 1.700 0.500 1.833 1.600
- Ozzie Albies 48.727 536 11 0.400 10 4 2 4 1.200 1.655 0.800 3.000 1.900
- Jesus Made 48.333 580 12 0.300 10 3 0 3 0.600 1.017 0.300 2.000 0.800
- Jac Caglianone 48.286 676 14 0.286 14 4 2 4 0.857 1.143 0.571 3.000 1.214
- Adley Rutschman 44.000 528 12 0.500 12 6 0 2 0.667 1.167 0.167 1.333 0.833
- Adrian Beltre 43.250 519 12 0.417 12 5 1 2 0.750 1.167 0.333 1.800 1.083
- Curtis Granderson 43.167 518 12 0.273 11 3 2 2 0.818 1.152 0.545 3.000 1.273
- Lance Berkman 38.462 500 13 0.231 13 3 0 2 0.385 0.615 0.154 1.667 0.385
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Surprised to see Wetherholt up there. Most people I see online seem to dismiss him. He doesn't have any outrageous offensive stats but only his Pow R is below 100.
He also has solid fielding and Baserunning stats, which PXP does not count for.
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@Bicarbonate_Fury_MLBTS said in Neon Position Players Ranked - Let's debate:
Simpson has been a stud in my speed/bunt team
Yeah, those baserunning stats and bunt attributes are elite.
Man, if only we could get a true stolen base legend, like say Lou Brock with those type of baserunning attributes (yeah, I'm still a little salty)
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@Dolenz_PSN I did steal bases with him (2) and others with higher speed attributes. There is PXP awarded for steals (10 for offline Rookie) and it also helped in getting into scoring position and with some additional runs scored (PXP awarded for runs as well) and stay out of DPs. I don't remember the times for those particular SBs to see if created a run that wouldn't have been scored without stealing those bases.
Definitely can't get PXP for defense, so that is something to consider. Also, people will probably hit differently with some players than I do as well.
Back to defense, I average probably around 25 Ks per 9 IPs offline, so I guess I don't necessarily need to worry about defensive attributes when I play offline modes! And most runs I give up are solo shots. "Three True Outcomes" is in effect when I pitch!
There are some surprises as to where some of the people fell on my list. I would have thought Bryan Reynolds would have been higher, but for the most part, my list is pretty much how I felt they had performed in gameplay (offensively).
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I took both my PXP/PA scores and Dolenz's Meta scores, normalized them (scale from 0 to 1), then averaged the two scores. I think this produced a better list...
AVGscore Player///DAPscore///DOLENZscore
- 0.952 Lou Gehrig///0.983///0.921
- 0.865 Bryan Reynolds///0.729///1.000
- 0.729 Willie Mays///0.607///0.851
- 0.726 Bobby Abreu///0.619///0.833
- 0.704 JJ Wetherholt///0.786///0.623
- 0.625 Konnor Griffin///0.610///0.640
- 0.622 Shawn Green///0.894///0.351
- 0.612 Kevin McGonigle///1.000///0.224
- 0.610 Rafael Palmeiro///0.768///0.452
- 0.599 Travis Bazzana///0.574///0.623
- 0.583 Derek Jeter///0.376///0.789
- 0.553 Jackson Merrill///0.645///0.461
- 0.497 Walker Jenkins///0.481///0.513
- 0.462 Chandler Simpson///0.516///0.408
- 0.435 Jesus Made///0.287///0.583
- 0.424 Colt Emerson///0.449///0.399
- 0.410 Geraldo Perdomo///0.412///0.408
- 0.403 Marcelo Mayer///0.478///0.329
- 0.382 Charlie Condon///0.545///0.219
- 0.379 Logan O'Hoppe///0.478///0.281
- 0.362 Ozzie Albies///0.298///0.425
- 0.350 Adrian Beltre///0.139///0.561
- 0.327 Tyler Soderstrom///0.510///0.145
- 0.314 Kyle Teel///0.364///0.263
- 0.294 Lance Berkman///0.000///0.588
- 0.291 Anthony Rizzo///0.446///0.136
- 0.255 Curtis Granderson///0.137///0.373
- 0.203 Adley Rutschman///0.161///0.246
- 0.143 Jac Caglianone///0.285///0.000
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@dap1234567890_PSN I'm all for any list that puts Gehrig above Reynolds.
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As a Pirates fan, the only thing I have to hold on to is Bryan being the best card. And he is according to your math. No additional analysis needed...
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@Dolenz_PSN Yeah, I think my second list is much better. McGonigle is nice, but is not the best card. Gehrig is the best and Bryan Reynolds is higher than what I had him at. My stats came from a small sample size, but I am not good with Berkman's swing so that dropped him all the way to the bottom of my list, but his card isn't the worst. So, I do think this second list does a better job in representing where the cards lie in my opinion.
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Probably because he’s not a switch hitter, and it seems like more than ever everything is switch meta. I miss the days when there were like 5 switch hitters and the slider glitch didn’t exist
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Right now I have nothing to grind for but I guess next inning i'll start using the Neon players.
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@dap1234567890_PSN said in Neon Position Players Ranked - Let's debate:
@Dolenz_PSN Yeah, I think my second list is much better. McGonigle is nice, but is not the best card. Gehrig is the best and Bryan Reynolds is higher than what I had him at. My stats came from a small sample size, but I am not good with Berkman's swing so that dropped him all the way to the bottom of my list, but his card isn't the worst. So, I do think this second list does a better job in representing where the cards lie in my opinion.
I'm all for everyone coming up with their own lists. Mine strictly uses attribute ratings because let's face it, I have almost none of them.
But we all know that different players have different preferences and have different results. Some people like Judge, some can't hit with him. Some people love Mays, others hates his stance. That is all subjective
I have come up with a Offense Players formula. In that list the Neon players are
#5 Gehrig
#9 Palmeiro
#13 Berkman
#23 Reynolds
#37 Mays
#39 Charlie Condon
#43 Marcelo Mayer
#47 Bobby AbreuSo it is Obvious that the 20% weighting of Fielding, Speed and Reaction make a big difference in the overall Meta Score as opposed to just offense.
I am not sure but in the overall Meta Formula I am thinking about taking Reaction down to 5% and the Bumping Vision to 10%. I am unsure though since Contact, Power and Clutch already contribute to 55% of the score and 65% of the overall score is based on offensive attributes.
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@Dolenz_PSN I enjoy crunching numbers which is why my masters degree is a Masters of Science in Business Analytics. I don't think we can come up with a perfect formula since cards play different and hard to assign numbers for stance, swing, and pitch delivery. Definitely would just have to play around with the formula until you are happy with it and fits your style the best. I find this interesting and how other people like to come up with formulas. I just happened to have each of those with nearly the same amount of PAs and thought that would be another interesting way to compare them. To get a truly good feel for them, I would need a bigger sample size. Like I said, I think this was fun to compare.
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Yeah, there is no perfect formula that works for everyone which is why I am sticking to strictly using the attributes as the basis for my rankings. The weighting of the different attributes is the only subjective part of the formula and even on those I let the AI come up with the formulas and the weightings to keep my bias and opinions out of the picture as much as possible.
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I'm a believer that swings can trump attributes
With that being said albies has a high leg kick and is almost the easiest card in the game IMO to time up pitches...especially off speed stuff. I think he may be my end game 2nd baseman bc of the swing.
I've struggled with Reynolds the past few years but didn't give him alot of run.
The old timers I tend to hit 280-320 with like gehrig/williams/Ruth.. So they're fine but not my favorites
