Willson Contreras
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Astros fan here, would love to see him added to our already potent lineup as Maldonado and Castro can't hit water if they fell out of a boat but have always been able to call good games even with a young pitching staff
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@koterba_mlbts said in Willson Contreras:
Astros fan here, would love to see him added to our already potent lineup as Maldonado and Castro can't hit water if they fell out of a boat but have always been able to call good games even with a young pitching staff
I’m good with that as long as they part with a few promising pitchers. Yankees or Astros seem most likely.
And yes, veteran catchers have value (even the ones that can’t hit). That’s why I was hoping they would extend Contreras. Youth seems to show most at this position.
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@solid-snake2493_xbl said in Willson Contreras:
@killerpresence4 said in Willson Contreras:
@bob_loblaw1984 said in Willson Contreras:
I love the guy and am a big Cubs fan. When the fire sale started last year I identified him as the one piece I’d like to keep for the next run. However, with the signing of Gomes and the apparent lack of interest in an extension, he is very likely to be traded.
He seems far and away the best catcher in baseball and the statistics support that so far this year. I am curious to hear any thoughts on the possibility of acquiring him from fans of potential playoff teams.
The Yankees and Astros seem like good matches as trade partners. They both appear to have a large need at C and have a long history of trades with the Cubs. I’m hoping for a few solid pitching prospect and those clubs have plenty. (Wesneski or Waldichuk from the Yankees pique my interest.)
What statistics support that claim. Baseball prospectus doesn’t even have him in the top 10 currently. The Atlanta Braves alone have two catchers that are offensively as good or better than him and both are better defensively than him. Here’s the funny thing one of those catchers ironically is his brother. So please tell what stats your talking about. And if you use WAR as your argument you’ve already lost the argument. WAR does not capture the catcher position any where close to other metrics. Metrics like pitch framing and blocking. Both of which he is terrible at. And oh btw Travis D’Arnaud as of a couple days ago had thrown out the most runners and the highest percent of caught stealing in the MLB.
Aggressive much? You clearly have no idea what your talking about, as you lost all credibility when you said Contreras is terrible at framing and blocking. News flash, this isn’t 2017 anymore. And it’s absolutely laughable that you think Willy’s brother is as good as or better than him currently.
So you make the argument that this isn’t 2017 for Contreras but provide zero to back up that claim. I’ll do the work for you. Here is Baseball prospectus catcher rankings with stats to back it up. No where on this list will you see Willson Contreras!!! He doesn’t come close on any advanced metrics. But I guess stats don’t matter anymore. Anecdotal evidence is obviously more important (i.e. the homer index).
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@killerpresence4 said in Willson Contreras:
@solid-snake2493_xbl said in Willson Contreras:
@killerpresence4 said in Willson Contreras:
@bob_loblaw1984 said in Willson Contreras:
I love the guy and am a big Cubs fan. When the fire sale started last year I identified him as the one piece I’d like to keep for the next run. However, with the signing of Gomes and the apparent lack of interest in an extension, he is very likely to be traded.
He seems far and away the best catcher in baseball and the statistics support that so far this year. I am curious to hear any thoughts on the possibility of acquiring him from fans of potential playoff teams.
The Yankees and Astros seem like good matches as trade partners. They both appear to have a large need at C and have a long history of trades with the Cubs. I’m hoping for a few solid pitching prospect and those clubs have plenty. (Wesneski or Waldichuk from the Yankees pique my interest.)
What statistics support that claim. Baseball prospectus doesn’t even have him in the top 10 currently. The Atlanta Braves alone have two catchers that are offensively as good or better than him and both are better defensively than him. Here’s the funny thing one of those catchers ironically is his brother. So please tell what stats your talking about. And if you use WAR as your argument you’ve already lost the argument. WAR does not capture the catcher position any where close to other metrics. Metrics like pitch framing and blocking. Both of which he is terrible at. And oh btw Travis D’Arnaud as of a couple days ago had thrown out the most runners and the highest percent of caught stealing in the MLB.
Aggressive much? You clearly have no idea what your talking about, as you lost all credibility when you said Contreras is terrible at framing and blocking. News flash, this isn’t 2017 anymore. And it’s absolutely laughable that you think Willy’s brother is as good as or better than him currently.
So you make the argument that this isn’t 2017 for Contreras but provide zero to back up that claim. I’ll do the work for you. Here is Baseball prospectus catcher rankings with stats to back it up. No where on this list will you see Willson Contreras!!! He doesn’t come close on any advanced metrics. But I guess stats don’t matter anymore. Anecdotal evidence is obviously more important (i.e. the homer index).
He didn’t make the claim. I did. I also provided evidence that you ignored. Good stuff.
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@bob_loblaw1984 said in Willson Contreras:
@killerpresence4 said in Willson Contreras:
@solid-snake2493_xbl said in Willson Contreras:
@killerpresence4 said in Willson Contreras:
@bob_loblaw1984 said in Willson Contreras:
I love the guy and am a big Cubs fan. When the fire sale started last year I identified him as the one piece I’d like to keep for the next run. However, with the signing of Gomes and the apparent lack of interest in an extension, he is very likely to be traded.
He seems far and away the best catcher in baseball and the statistics support that so far this year. I am curious to hear any thoughts on the possibility of acquiring him from fans of potential playoff teams.
The Yankees and Astros seem like good matches as trade partners. They both appear to have a large need at C and have a long history of trades with the Cubs. I’m hoping for a few solid pitching prospect and those clubs have plenty. (Wesneski or Waldichuk from the Yankees pique my interest.)
What statistics support that claim. Baseball prospectus doesn’t even have him in the top 10 currently. The Atlanta Braves alone have two catchers that are offensively as good or better than him and both are better defensively than him. Here’s the funny thing one of those catchers ironically is his brother. So please tell what stats your talking about. And if you use WAR as your argument you’ve already lost the argument. WAR does not capture the catcher position any where close to other metrics. Metrics like pitch framing and blocking. Both of which he is terrible at. And oh btw Travis D’Arnaud as of a couple days ago had thrown out the most runners and the highest percent of caught stealing in the MLB.
Aggressive much? You clearly have no idea what your talking about, as you lost all credibility when you said Contreras is terrible at framing and blocking. News flash, this isn’t 2017 anymore. And it’s absolutely laughable that you think Willy’s brother is as good as or better than him currently.
So you make the argument that this isn’t 2017 for Contreras but provide zero to back up that claim. I’ll do the work for you. Here is Baseball prospectus catcher rankings with stats to back it up. No where on this list will you see Willson Contreras!!! He doesn’t come close on any advanced metrics. But I guess stats don’t matter anymore. Anecdotal evidence is obviously more important (i.e. the homer index).
He didn’t make the claim. I did. I also provided evidence that you ignored. Good stuff.
You provided one stat. Last time I checked offense is one aspect of a catchers job. And offense is the least important aspect when it comes to catchers. He is still a terrible framer and blocker. And according to the stats he is a serviceable thrower but still not elite. Sorry to burst your bubble.
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@killerpresence4 said in Willson Contreras:
@bob_loblaw1984 said in Willson Contreras:
@killerpresence4 said in Willson Contreras:
@solid-snake2493_xbl said in Willson Contreras:
@killerpresence4 said in Willson Contreras:
@bob_loblaw1984 said in Willson Contreras:
I love the guy and am a big Cubs fan. When the fire sale started last year I identified him as the one piece I’d like to keep for the next run. However, with the signing of Gomes and the apparent lack of interest in an extension, he is very likely to be traded.
He seems far and away the best catcher in baseball and the statistics support that so far this year. I am curious to hear any thoughts on the possibility of acquiring him from fans of potential playoff teams.
The Yankees and Astros seem like good matches as trade partners. They both appear to have a large need at C and have a long history of trades with the Cubs. I’m hoping for a few solid pitching prospect and those clubs have plenty. (Wesneski or Waldichuk from the Yankees pique my interest.)
What statistics support that claim. Baseball prospectus doesn’t even have him in the top 10 currently. The Atlanta Braves alone have two catchers that are offensively as good or better than him and both are better defensively than him. Here’s the funny thing one of those catchers ironically is his brother. So please tell what stats your talking about. And if you use WAR as your argument you’ve already lost the argument. WAR does not capture the catcher position any where close to other metrics. Metrics like pitch framing and blocking. Both of which he is terrible at. And oh btw Travis D’Arnaud as of a couple days ago had thrown out the most runners and the highest percent of caught stealing in the MLB.
Aggressive much? You clearly have no idea what your talking about, as you lost all credibility when you said Contreras is terrible at framing and blocking. News flash, this isn’t 2017 anymore. And it’s absolutely laughable that you think Willy’s brother is as good as or better than him currently.
So you make the argument that this isn’t 2017 for Contreras but provide zero to back up that claim. I’ll do the work for you. Here is Baseball prospectus catcher rankings with stats to back it up. No where on this list will you see Willson Contreras!!! He doesn’t come close on any advanced metrics. But I guess stats don’t matter anymore. Anecdotal evidence is obviously more important (i.e. the homer index).
He didn’t make the claim. I did. I also provided evidence that you ignored. Good stuff.
You provided one stat. Last time I checked offense is one aspect of a catchers job. And offense is the least important aspect when it comes to catchers. He is still a terrible framer and blocker. And according to the stats he is a serviceable thrower but still not elite. Sorry to burst your bubble.
The guy has the potential to be one of the best hitting catchers in the game for the next few years. As long as he is decent behind the plate he will always have a job. Why do you think guys like Gary Sanchez hold the position for so long?
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@killerpresence4 said in Willson Contreras:
@bob_loblaw1984 said in Willson Contreras:
@killerpresence4 said in Willson Contreras:
@solid-snake2493_xbl said in Willson Contreras:
@killerpresence4 said in Willson Contreras:
@bob_loblaw1984 said in Willson Contreras:
I love the guy and am a big Cubs fan. When the fire sale started last year I identified him as the one piece I’d like to keep for the next run. However, with the signing of Gomes and the apparent lack of interest in an extension, he is very likely to be traded.
He seems far and away the best catcher in baseball and the statistics support that so far this year. I am curious to hear any thoughts on the possibility of acquiring him from fans of potential playoff teams.
The Yankees and Astros seem like good matches as trade partners. They both appear to have a large need at C and have a long history of trades with the Cubs. I’m hoping for a few solid pitching prospect and those clubs have plenty. (Wesneski or Waldichuk from the Yankees pique my interest.)
What statistics support that claim. Baseball prospectus doesn’t even have him in the top 10 currently. The Atlanta Braves alone have two catchers that are offensively as good or better than him and both are better defensively than him. Here’s the funny thing one of those catchers ironically is his brother. So please tell what stats your talking about. And if you use WAR as your argument you’ve already lost the argument. WAR does not capture the catcher position any where close to other metrics. Metrics like pitch framing and blocking. Both of which he is terrible at. And oh btw Travis D’Arnaud as of a couple days ago had thrown out the most runners and the highest percent of caught stealing in the MLB.
Aggressive much? You clearly have no idea what your talking about, as you lost all credibility when you said Contreras is terrible at framing and blocking. News flash, this isn’t 2017 anymore. And it’s absolutely laughable that you think Willy’s brother is as good as or better than him currently.
So you make the argument that this isn’t 2017 for Contreras but provide zero to back up that claim. I’ll do the work for you. Here is Baseball prospectus catcher rankings with stats to back it up. No where on this list will you see Willson Contreras!!! He doesn’t come close on any advanced metrics. But I guess stats don’t matter anymore. Anecdotal evidence is obviously more important (i.e. the homer index).
He didn’t make the claim. I did. I also provided evidence that you ignored. Good stuff.
You provided one stat. Last time I checked offense is one aspect of a catchers job. And offense is the least important aspect when it comes to catchers. He is still a terrible framer and blocker. And according to the stats he is a serviceable thrower but still not elite. Sorry to burst your bubble.
You don’t seem to understand sample sizes. Especially when it comes to defensive metrics. Contreras is a much better defender than you describe. Maybe look at more than just a 7 week old season and look with less bias.
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@bob_loblaw1984 said in Willson Contreras:
I love the guy and am a big Cubs fan. When the fire sale started last year I identified him as the one piece I’d like to keep for the next run. However, with the signing of Gomes and the apparent lack of interest in an extension, he is very likely to be traded.
He seems far and away the best catcher in baseball and the statistics support that so far this year. I am curious to hear any thoughts on the possibility of acquiring him from fans of potential playoff teams.
The Yankees and Astros seem like good matches as trade partners. They both appear to have a large need at C and have a long history of trades with the Cubs. I’m hoping for a few solid pitching prospect and those clubs have plenty. (Wesneski or Waldichuk from the Yankees pique my interest.)
I'm a lifelong cubs fan and I believe Wilson is one of the best players out there. Not only for his skill but the guy loves to compete and he wants to win every single at bat and every game. I love baez as well for the same reason. Those guys do not quit and they are winners. Willson may not be the best defensive catcher in the world but the dude wants to win every single game he plays. Even when he dh's he wants to get on base. I love him and I hope they don't get rid of him. They've already gutted the team I hope they keep him he deserves it. I know he wants to stay there and he deserves a payday.
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@bob_loblaw1984 said in Willson Contreras:
@killerpresence4 said in Willson Contreras:
@bob_loblaw1984 said in Willson Contreras:
@killerpresence4 said in Willson Contreras:
@solid-snake2493_xbl said in Willson Contreras:
@killerpresence4 said in Willson Contreras:
@bob_loblaw1984 said in Willson Contreras:
I love the guy and am a big Cubs fan. When the fire sale started last year I identified him as the one piece I’d like to keep for the next run. However, with the signing of Gomes and the apparent lack of interest in an extension, he is very likely to be traded.
He seems far and away the best catcher in baseball and the statistics support that so far this year. I am curious to hear any thoughts on the possibility of acquiring him from fans of potential playoff teams.
The Yankees and Astros seem like good matches as trade partners. They both appear to have a large need at C and have a long history of trades with the Cubs. I’m hoping for a few solid pitching prospect and those clubs have plenty. (Wesneski or Waldichuk from the Yankees pique my interest.)
What statistics support that claim. Baseball prospectus doesn’t even have him in the top 10 currently. The Atlanta Braves alone have two catchers that are offensively as good or better than him and both are better defensively than him. Here’s the funny thing one of those catchers ironically is his brother. So please tell what stats your talking about. And if you use WAR as your argument you’ve already lost the argument. WAR does not capture the catcher position any where close to other metrics. Metrics like pitch framing and blocking. Both of which he is terrible at. And oh btw Travis D’Arnaud as of a couple days ago had thrown out the most runners and the highest percent of caught stealing in the MLB.
Aggressive much? You clearly have no idea what your talking about, as you lost all credibility when you said Contreras is terrible at framing and blocking. News flash, this isn’t 2017 anymore. And it’s absolutely laughable that you think Willy’s brother is as good as or better than him currently.
So you make the argument that this isn’t 2017 for Contreras but provide zero to back up that claim. I’ll do the work for you. Here is Baseball prospectus catcher rankings with stats to back it up. No where on this list will you see Willson Contreras!!! He doesn’t come close on any advanced metrics. But I guess stats don’t matter anymore. Anecdotal evidence is obviously more important (i.e. the homer index).
He didn’t make the claim. I did. I also provided evidence that you ignored. Good stuff.
You provided one stat. Last time I checked offense is one aspect of a catchers job. And offense is the least important aspect when it comes to catchers. He is still a terrible framer and blocker. And according to the stats he is a serviceable thrower but still not elite. Sorry to burst your bubble.
You don’t seem to understand sample sizes. Especially when it comes to defensive metrics. Contreras is a much better defender than you describe. Maybe look at more than just a 7 week old season and look with less bias.
You made the claim for this year. I just used stats to refute that claim then you say that one year doesn’t make the player. Well his stats this year don’t support your claim. That’s all. I’m not saying he isn’t one of the best based on his track record but this year is certainly not one of his best up to this point in the season. Also his brother has been real good in a short sample size with two multiple homer games and his amazing defensive improvements. But yes we need to see more.
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@killerpresence4 said in Willson Contreras:
@bob_loblaw1984 said in Willson Contreras:
@killerpresence4 said in Willson Contreras:
@bob_loblaw1984 said in Willson Contreras:
@killerpresence4 said in Willson Contreras:
@solid-snake2493_xbl said in Willson Contreras:
@killerpresence4 said in Willson Contreras:
@bob_loblaw1984 said in Willson Contreras:
I love the guy and am a big Cubs fan. When the fire sale started last year I identified him as the one piece I’d like to keep for the next run. However, with the signing of Gomes and the apparent lack of interest in an extension, he is very likely to be traded.
He seems far and away the best catcher in baseball and the statistics support that so far this year. I am curious to hear any thoughts on the possibility of acquiring him from fans of potential playoff teams.
The Yankees and Astros seem like good matches as trade partners. They both appear to have a large need at C and have a long history of trades with the Cubs. I’m hoping for a few solid pitching prospect and those clubs have plenty. (Wesneski or Waldichuk from the Yankees pique my interest.)
What statistics support that claim. Baseball prospectus doesn’t even have him in the top 10 currently. The Atlanta Braves alone have two catchers that are offensively as good or better than him and both are better defensively than him. Here’s the funny thing one of those catchers ironically is his brother. So please tell what stats your talking about. And if you use WAR as your argument you’ve already lost the argument. WAR does not capture the catcher position any where close to other metrics. Metrics like pitch framing and blocking. Both of which he is terrible at. And oh btw Travis D’Arnaud as of a couple days ago had thrown out the most runners and the highest percent of caught stealing in the MLB.
Aggressive much? You clearly have no idea what your talking about, as you lost all credibility when you said Contreras is terrible at framing and blocking. News flash, this isn’t 2017 anymore. And it’s absolutely laughable that you think Willy’s brother is as good as or better than him currently.
So you make the argument that this isn’t 2017 for Contreras but provide zero to back up that claim. I’ll do the work for you. Here is Baseball prospectus catcher rankings with stats to back it up. No where on this list will you see Willson Contreras!!! He doesn’t come close on any advanced metrics. But I guess stats don’t matter anymore. Anecdotal evidence is obviously more important (i.e. the homer index).
He didn’t make the claim. I did. I also provided evidence that you ignored. Good stuff.
You provided one stat. Last time I checked offense is one aspect of a catchers job. And offense is the least important aspect when it comes to catchers. He is still a terrible framer and blocker. And according to the stats he is a serviceable thrower but still not elite. Sorry to burst your bubble.
You don’t seem to understand sample sizes. Especially when it comes to defensive metrics. Contreras is a much better defender than you describe. Maybe look at more than just a 7 week old season and look with less bias.
You made the claim for this year. I just used stats to refute that claim then you say that one year doesn’t make the player. Well his stats this year don’t support your claim. That’s all. I’m not saying he isn’t one of the best based on his track record but this year is certainly not one of his best up to this point in the season. Also his brother has been real good in a short sample size with two multiple homer games and his amazing defensive improvements. But yes we need to see more.
7 weeks of offensive statistics are far more reliable than defensive metrics from the same timeframe. They are highly subjective and have crazy fluctuations.
But I’m not engaging with you anymore. You are hyperbolic, misinformed, and aimed to hijack a thread about trade discussion.
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@Bob_LobLaw1984_MLBTS
Maybe I'm way off here but how would this sound:Mets receive:
Willson ContrerasCubs receive:
Mark Vientos
Jose Butto
Choice of Nido or Mazeika -
@kovz88_psn said in Willson Contreras:
@Bob_LobLaw1984_MLBTS
Maybe I'm way off here but how would this sound:Mets receive:
Willson ContrerasCubs receive:
Mark Vientos
Jose Butto
Choice of Nido or MazeikaButto I like.
Vientos doesn’t really fit what the front office has been trying to do, ridding their lineup of swing and miss guys.
I’d imagine they aren’t interested in another C unless it’s somebody like Álvarez and I think parting with him is unlikely for a rental.
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@bob_loblaw1984 said in Willson Contreras:
@allday9128_psn said in Willson Contreras:
Let's send him to the twins for Royce Lewis
They’ll need him when Correa opts out. Greater chance of the Cubs signing Correa at that point than trading for Lewis now. I do think Hoerner will get an extended shot at the job anyway. He deserves it. Bring on the pitching depth.
correa's coming back, we wouldnt need wilson anyways. Gary Sanchez clears.
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@guccigangchuck said in Willson Contreras:
@bob_loblaw1984 said in Willson Contreras:
@allday9128_psn said in Willson Contreras:
Let's send him to the twins for Royce Lewis
They’ll need him when Correa opts out. Greater chance of the Cubs signing Correa at that point than trading for Lewis now. I do think Hoerner will get an extended shot at the job anyway. He deserves it. Bring on the pitching depth.
correa's coming back, we wouldnt need wilson anyways. Gary Sanchez clears.
Only way Correa stays is if he expects to get paid less as a free agent. If he performs that won’t be the case.
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@bob_loblaw1984 said in Willson Contreras:
@kovz88_psn said in Willson Contreras:
@Bob_LobLaw1984_MLBTS
Maybe I'm way off here but how would this sound:Mets receive:
Willson ContrerasCubs receive:
Mark Vientos
Jose Butto
Choice of Nido or MazeikaButto I like.
Vientos doesn’t really fit what the front office has been trying to do, ridding their lineup of swing and miss guys.
I’d imagine they aren’t interested in another C unless it’s somebody like Álvarez and I think parting with him is unlikely for a rental.
I would definitely say Álvarez is untouchable right now. Vientos I understand. Mets have a lot of good looking pitching at the lower levels so if the Cubs are looking for pitching depth I'm sure they could find some guys they like.
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The Cardinals will have an opening at Catcher at the end of the year. You think we can bridge our rivalry long enough to make a fair trade?
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@bob_loblaw1984 said in Willson Contreras:
@killerpresence4 said in Willson Contreras:
@bob_loblaw1984 said in Willson Contreras:
@killerpresence4 said in Willson Contreras:
@bob_loblaw1984 said in Willson Contreras:
@killerpresence4 said in Willson Contreras:
@solid-snake2493_xbl said in Willson Contreras:
@killerpresence4 said in Willson Contreras:
@bob_loblaw1984 said in Willson Contreras:
I love the guy and am a big Cubs fan. When the fire sale started last year I identified him as the one piece I’d like to keep for the next run. However, with the signing of Gomes and the apparent lack of interest in an extension, he is very likely to be traded.
He seems far and away the best catcher in baseball and the statistics support that so far this year. I am curious to hear any thoughts on the possibility of acquiring him from fans of potential playoff teams.
The Yankees and Astros seem like good matches as trade partners. They both appear to have a large need at C and have a long history of trades with the Cubs. I’m hoping for a few solid pitching prospect and those clubs have plenty. (Wesneski or Waldichuk from the Yankees pique my interest.)
What statistics support that claim. Baseball prospectus doesn’t even have him in the top 10 currently. The Atlanta Braves alone have two catchers that are offensively as good or better than him and both are better defensively than him. Here’s the funny thing one of those catchers ironically is his brother. So please tell what stats your talking about. And if you use WAR as your argument you’ve already lost the argument. WAR does not capture the catcher position any where close to other metrics. Metrics like pitch framing and blocking. Both of which he is terrible at. And oh btw Travis D’Arnaud as of a couple days ago had thrown out the most runners and the highest percent of caught stealing in the MLB.
Aggressive much? You clearly have no idea what your talking about, as you lost all credibility when you said Contreras is terrible at framing and blocking. News flash, this isn’t 2017 anymore. And it’s absolutely laughable that you think Willy’s brother is as good as or better than him currently.
So you make the argument that this isn’t 2017 for Contreras but provide zero to back up that claim. I’ll do the work for you. Here is Baseball prospectus catcher rankings with stats to back it up. No where on this list will you see Willson Contreras!!! He doesn’t come close on any advanced metrics. But I guess stats don’t matter anymore. Anecdotal evidence is obviously more important (i.e. the homer index).
He didn’t make the claim. I did. I also provided evidence that you ignored. Good stuff.
You provided one stat. Last time I checked offense is one aspect of a catchers job. And offense is the least important aspect when it comes to catchers. He is still a terrible framer and blocker. And according to the stats he is a serviceable thrower but still not elite. Sorry to burst your bubble.
You don’t seem to understand sample sizes. Especially when it comes to defensive metrics. Contreras is a much better defender than you describe. Maybe look at more than just a 7 week old season and look with less bias.
You made the claim for this year. I just used stats to refute that claim then you say that one year doesn’t make the player. Well his stats this year don’t support your claim. That’s all. I’m not saying he isn’t one of the best based on his track record but this year is certainly not one of his best up to this point in the season. Also his brother has been real good in a short sample size with two multiple homer games and his amazing defensive improvements. But yes we need to see more.
7 weeks of offensive statistics are far more reliable than defensive metrics from the same timeframe. They are highly subjective and have crazy fluctuations.
But I’m not engaging with you anymore. You are hyperbolic, misinformed, and aimed to hijack a thread about trade discussion.
No sir, you made a sweeping statement that was absolutely false. There was no hyperbole, certainly not misinformed as I provided actual stats while you provided one single stat about OPS. As if that’s the only stat that makes a player. And no it was not aimed to hijack your thread. If your going to make false statements about stats people are going to call you out. Have a good day bud. Next time do some research before allowing your personal feelings taint your argument.
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@ericulous1_psn said in Willson Contreras:
The Cardinals will have an opening at Catcher at the end of the year. You think we can bridge our rivalry long enough to make a fair trade?
Haha. You can just sign him at that point. I don’t think a trade is likely with the Cards.
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@killerpresence4 said in Willson Contreras:
@bob_loblaw1984 said in Willson Contreras:
@killerpresence4 said in Willson Contreras:
@bob_loblaw1984 said in Willson Contreras:
@killerpresence4 said in Willson Contreras:
@bob_loblaw1984 said in Willson Contreras:
@killerpresence4 said in Willson Contreras:
@solid-snake2493_xbl said in Willson Contreras:
@killerpresence4 said in Willson Contreras:
@bob_loblaw1984 said in Willson Contreras:
I love the guy and am a big Cubs fan. When the fire sale started last year I identified him as the one piece I’d like to keep for the next run. However, with the signing of Gomes and the apparent lack of interest in an extension, he is very likely to be traded.
He seems far and away the best catcher in baseball and the statistics support that so far this year. I am curious to hear any thoughts on the possibility of acquiring him from fans of potential playoff teams.
The Yankees and Astros seem like good matches as trade partners. They both appear to have a large need at C and have a long history of trades with the Cubs. I’m hoping for a few solid pitching prospect and those clubs have plenty. (Wesneski or Waldichuk from the Yankees pique my interest.)
What statistics support that claim. Baseball prospectus doesn’t even have him in the top 10 currently. The Atlanta Braves alone have two catchers that are offensively as good or better than him and both are better defensively than him. Here’s the funny thing one of those catchers ironically is his brother. So please tell what stats your talking about. And if you use WAR as your argument you’ve already lost the argument. WAR does not capture the catcher position any where close to other metrics. Metrics like pitch framing and blocking. Both of which he is terrible at. And oh btw Travis D’Arnaud as of a couple days ago had thrown out the most runners and the highest percent of caught stealing in the MLB.
Aggressive much? You clearly have no idea what your talking about, as you lost all credibility when you said Contreras is terrible at framing and blocking. News flash, this isn’t 2017 anymore. And it’s absolutely laughable that you think Willy’s brother is as good as or better than him currently.
So you make the argument that this isn’t 2017 for Contreras but provide zero to back up that claim. I’ll do the work for you. Here is Baseball prospectus catcher rankings with stats to back it up. No where on this list will you see Willson Contreras!!! He doesn’t come close on any advanced metrics. But I guess stats don’t matter anymore. Anecdotal evidence is obviously more important (i.e. the homer index).
He didn’t make the claim. I did. I also provided evidence that you ignored. Good stuff.
You provided one stat. Last time I checked offense is one aspect of a catchers job. And offense is the least important aspect when it comes to catchers. He is still a terrible framer and blocker. And according to the stats he is a serviceable thrower but still not elite. Sorry to burst your bubble.
You don’t seem to understand sample sizes. Especially when it comes to defensive metrics. Contreras is a much better defender than you describe. Maybe look at more than just a 7 week old season and look with less bias.
You made the claim for this year. I just used stats to refute that claim then you say that one year doesn’t make the player. Well his stats this year don’t support your claim. That’s all. I’m not saying he isn’t one of the best based on his track record but this year is certainly not one of his best up to this point in the season. Also his brother has been real good in a short sample size with two multiple homer games and his amazing defensive improvements. But yes we need to see more.
7 weeks of offensive statistics are far more reliable than defensive metrics from the same timeframe. They are highly subjective and have crazy fluctuations.
But I’m not engaging with you anymore. You are hyperbolic, misinformed, and aimed to hijack a thread about trade discussion.
No sir, you made a sweeping statement that was absolutely false. There was no hyperbole, certainly not misinformed as I provided actual stats while you provided one single stat about OPS. As if that’s the only stat that makes a player. And no it was not aimed to hijack your thread. If your going to make false statements about stats people are going to call you out. Have a good day bud. Next time do some research before allowing your personal feelings taint your argument.
Saying his brother is better, who is a backup with 30 ABs, isn’t hyperbolic? Cool man.
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"Willson Contreras hammers baseballs. He has upped his average exit velocity every season since 2017. It was methodical at the start; 88.1mph in 2017, 88.5mph in 2019. But then, 89.8mph in 2020, and 91.8mph in 2021. He consistently peppers balls north of 110 miles per hour. This past year, he had both the highest hard-hit rate and the highest launch angle of his career. All-in-all, he logged his third 20-homer season while getting on base at a .340 clip.
AD – CONTENT CONTINUES BELOW
Defensively, he’s got a hose. In 2019, he logged the third-best average pop-time in Major League Baseball, only three-hundredths of a second off of J.T. Realmuto for the top spot. He plays with runners. If Yadier Molina perfected the back-pick at first base, Willson Contreras is the best copycat.
If the question is Willson vs. Sean Murphy for the sixth spot on this list, Willson’s 29 years old. He’s got a career 114 wRC+ and logged a 109 wRC+ last year. Murphy is a career 109 wRC+ with a 99 wRC+ in 2021. In 2022, with the track record and recent offensive success playing in, Willson is slightly preferred."
Just a quick Google search for best catchers has him In everyone's top 10 list and here is a good explanation I pulled out of why he's looked at so fondly. Also trying to say D'arnaud is a top catcher clearly shows you e never actually watched the guy play.
