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@ikasnu_psn said in Cleveland Gaurdians:
@ladyswampfox_xbl said in Cleveland Gaurdians:
Guardians? Guardians of what, exactly? I feel like there's a better name they could use... oh, that's right! Cleveland Indians!
I'm not even an Indians fan and it sucks. Now I have to deal with this PC name every time my Tigers play them—being in the same division, it will be all the time.
I despise it when long history is just thrown out the window because it doesn't conform to today's standards. It's like saying that George Washington was a terrible leader because he didn't practice good dental hygiene. It is unfair to judge the past that way. I understand the discontinuation of the Chief Wahoo logo (pardon my usage of the term, I'm just saying it to be specific and clear), but this name change feels like stripping the Indians of their storied legacy. Feels like they're a brand new team with nothing to their name now.
I think one of the problems with the name itself is that we weren't even calling them what they were. They're not Indians, they're native americans.
Natives imo would of been a better name for the team, but I know they don't want to represent a group of people.Believe it or not all words are made up. They probably called them that because when they got over here and asked they didn’t know they were Native Americans until somebody told them they were. They probably didn’t even know they lived in America tbh with the low level education system they had.
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Officially rename to "Tribe" Make a statement that Tribe represents the many groups who live within our Cleveland community and as a whole we can be united behind the team that represents our city. Tribe is also a reference to the many Native American communities who lived in the Ohio region for thousands of years. To help educate visitors to our ball park the Cleveland Natural History Museum has set up a display "History of Native Americans" in the stadium. We will be donating $XXXX for every win the "tribe" has this season and every season to the xxxx xxxx foundation to help promote Native American Studies.
This is what I think they should have done. Don't brush away past mistakes and hope they go away. Rather own them and correct them and help others understand more about the culture rather than allow that culture to be slowly evaporated.
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@untchable704_psn said in Cleveland Gaurdians:
@ikasnu_psn said in Cleveland Gaurdians:
@ladyswampfox_xbl said in Cleveland Gaurdians:
Guardians? Guardians of what, exactly? I feel like there's a better name they could use... oh, that's right! Cleveland Indians!
I'm not even an Indians fan and it sucks. Now I have to deal with this PC name every time my Tigers play them—being in the same division, it will be all the time.
I despise it when long history is just thrown out the window because it doesn't conform to today's standards. It's like saying that George Washington was a terrible leader because he didn't practice good dental hygiene. It is unfair to judge the past that way. I understand the discontinuation of the Chief Wahoo logo (pardon my usage of the term, I'm just saying it to be specific and clear), but this name change feels like stripping the Indians of their storied legacy. Feels like they're a brand new team with nothing to their name now.
I think one of the problems with the name itself is that we weren't even calling them what they were. They're not Indians, they're native americans.
Natives imo would of been a better name for the team, but I know they don't want to represent a group of people.Believe it or not all words are made up. They probably called them that because when they got over here and asked they didn’t know they were Native Americans until somebody told them they were. They probably didn’t even know they lived in America tbh with the low level education system they had.
Wasn't called America until it was given that name.
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@untchable704_psn said in Cleveland Gaurdians:
@ikasnu_psn said in Cleveland Gaurdians:
@ladyswampfox_xbl said in Cleveland Gaurdians:
Guardians? Guardians of what, exactly? I feel like there's a better name they could use... oh, that's right! Cleveland Indians!
I'm not even an Indians fan and it sucks. Now I have to deal with this PC name every time my Tigers play them—being in the same division, it will be all the time.
I despise it when long history is just thrown out the window because it doesn't conform to today's standards. It's like saying that George Washington was a terrible leader because he didn't practice good dental hygiene. It is unfair to judge the past that way. I understand the discontinuation of the Chief Wahoo logo (pardon my usage of the term, I'm just saying it to be specific and clear), but this name change feels like stripping the Indians of their storied legacy. Feels like they're a brand new team with nothing to their name now.
I think one of the problems with the name itself is that we weren't even calling them what they were. They're not Indians, they're native americans.
Natives imo would of been a better name for the team, but I know they don't want to represent a group of people.Believe it or not all words are made up. They probably called them that because when they got over here and asked they didn’t know they were Native Americans until somebody told them they were. They probably didn’t even know they lived in America tbh with the low level education system they had.
No they though they were Indonesia and just never cared to actually learn about it. And for us so many years later to not recognize them for what they actually are and refuse to adapt is kinda dumb.
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Things were a little different in 1918 than they are now. Naming your team after genocide victims and giving them a cheeky mascot is no longer good branding.
Names change. This is the fifth time for the franchise. You will survive. The people the team was named after did not.
The people crying “cancel culture” here are the real snowflakes that can’t handle change.
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Bob Feller is rolling over in his grave.
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@bozzman0109_psn said in Cleveland Gaurdians:
Officially rename to "Tribe" Make a statement that Tribe represents the many groups who live within our Cleveland community and as a whole we can be united behind the team that represents our city. Tribe is also a reference to the many Native American communities who lived in the Ohio region for thousands of years. To help educate visitors to our ball park the Cleveland Natural History Museum has set up a display "History of Native Americans" in the stadium. We will be donating $XXXX for every win the "tribe" has this season and every season to the xxxx xxxx foundation to help promote Native American Studies.
This is what I think they should have done. Don't brush away past mistakes and hope they go away. Rather own them and correct them and help others understand more about the culture rather than allow that culture to be slowly evaporated.
I like "Tribe". It fits the bill of being similar in namesake without actually representing any specific people, tribes are just a group of people, but with many different cultural origins.
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It's always funny how many of the "cancel culture" "don't erase history" people clearly never payed any attention in history class.
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I honestly think they should have left it at Cleveland Baseball Club and just put Cleveland across the jersey. When you really think about it, most team nicknames are kind of dumb.
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As a lifelong Clevelander, and "Indians" fan, I'm severely disappointed, sad, and angry.
It was an inevitability that was already announced, and known, but it doesn't make it any better knowing now it's official.
I understand to some people Chief Wahoo was deemed insensitive, and racist to people, but ultimately it existed, and I feel like the History of Baseball is being tarnished, and erased regardless of people's opinions or beliefs on the matter.
I was disgusted when Jim Thome's plaque in the Hall of Fame had him wearing a Block C on his hat, and I'm disgusted by this even more.
Chief Wahoo was a massive hotbed of controversy, but to change the name of the team entirely...........It never needed to go that far. I guess Louis Sockalexis, and the vast Heritage, and History of Native Americans in northeast Ohio historically means absolutely nothing to anybody relevant here.........It's a sad day.
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Anyway, it happend, those not in favor of it, suck it up. Beisbol.
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@kovz88_psn said in Cleveland Gaurdians:
It's always funny how many of the "cancel culture" "don't erase history" people clearly never payed any attention in history class.
I paid attention.....if you forget history you are doomed to repeat it. To try to remove mention of the past, whether good or bad, serves no purpose. It can allow the past, again whether good or bad, a chance to repeat because no lessons or taught and no visible memories remain. When will some understand you can not make a society perfect nor a past different.
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If they picked a better name than Guardians, people would be less upset… It’s so boring and bland, we knew the Indians were going to change the name, but really with everything in Ohio they could pick from, they picked a default create a team name.
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I just keep coming back for the laughs
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@StingrayHD_XBL
Noone is saying act like it never existed or dont teach about the horrors of the past. We are saying don't honor them or display them with statues or other offerings. Teach it, don't honor it. -
@stingrayhd_xbl said in Cleveland Gaurdians:
@kovz88_psn said in Cleveland Gaurdians:
It's always funny how many of the "cancel culture" "don't erase history" people clearly never payed any attention in history class.
I paid attention.....if you forget history you are doomed to repeat it. To try to remove mention of the past, whether good or bad, serves no purpose. It can allow the past, again whether good or bad, a chance to repeat because no lessons or taught and no visible memories remain. When will some understand you can not make a society perfect nor a past different.
In their official statement they explicitly say it will always be a part of their history.
Choosing not to celebrate a history isn’t erasing it. I don’t think the Germans are forgetting about Nazis anytime soon due to lack of Hitler statues. Neither are Americans forgetting about the Civil War due to lack of Confederate monuments.
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@stingrayhd_xbl said in Cleveland Gaurdians:
@kovz88_psn said in Cleveland Gaurdians:
It's always funny how many of the "cancel culture" "don't erase history" people clearly never payed any attention in history class.
I paid attention.....if you forget history you are doomed to repeat it. To try to remove mention of the past, whether good or bad, serves no purpose. It can allow the past, again whether good or bad, a chance to repeat because no lessons or taught and no visible memories remain. When will some understand you can not make a society perfect nor a past different.
How will anyone know who Nathan Bedford Forrest is without a statue?
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@poksey_mlbts said in Cleveland Gaurdians:
@stingrayhd_xbl said in Cleveland Gaurdians:
@kovz88_psn said in Cleveland Gaurdians:
It's always funny how many of the "cancel culture" "don't erase history" people clearly never payed any attention in history class.
I paid attention.....if you forget history you are doomed to repeat it. To try to remove mention of the past, whether good or bad, serves no purpose. It can allow the past, again whether good or bad, a chance to repeat because no lessons or taught and no visible memories remain. When will some understand you can not make a society perfect nor a past different.
How will anyone know who Nathan Bedford Forrest is without a statue?
Who?
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@bozzman0109_psn said in Cleveland Gaurdians:
@poksey_mlbts said in Cleveland Gaurdians:
@stingrayhd_xbl said in Cleveland Gaurdians:
@kovz88_psn said in Cleveland Gaurdians:
It's always funny how many of the "cancel culture" "don't erase history" people clearly never payed any attention in history class.
I paid attention.....if you forget history you are doomed to repeat it. To try to remove mention of the past, whether good or bad, serves no purpose. It can allow the past, again whether good or bad, a chance to repeat because no lessons or taught and no visible memories remain. When will some understand you can not make a society perfect nor a past different.
How will anyone know who Nathan Bedford Forrest is without a statue?
Who?
Confederate general and KKK douche.
And I’d guess they would have to read a book, watch a documentary (not Forrest Gump), go to a museum, or take a history class.
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@bob_loblaw1984 said in Cleveland Gaurdians:
@bozzman0109_psn said in Cleveland Gaurdians:
@poksey_mlbts said in Cleveland Gaurdians:
@stingrayhd_xbl said in Cleveland Gaurdians:
@kovz88_psn said in Cleveland Gaurdians:
It's always funny how many of the "cancel culture" "don't erase history" people clearly never payed any attention in history class.
I paid attention.....if you forget history you are doomed to repeat it. To try to remove mention of the past, whether good or bad, serves no purpose. It can allow the past, again whether good or bad, a chance to repeat because no lessons or taught and no visible memories remain. When will some understand you can not make a society perfect nor a past different.
How will anyone know who Nathan Bedford Forrest is without a statue?
Who?
Confederate general and KKK douche.
And I’d guess they would have to read a book, watch a documentary (not Forrest Gump), go to a museum, or take a history class.
I guess some people should be forgotten
