For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history
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@dingers4days14 said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@Buck_Mango said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@dingers4days14 said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@Buck_Mango said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
https://www.si.com/mlb/2020/01/23/sign-stealing-history-astros-red-sox
if you aint cheating you aint trying, cheating has been going on in sports since the inception of sports just sometimes people get caught. had they admitted to it, no worries water under the bridge.
It really must suck to be an Astros fan knowing that you barely won one title by cheating when the Giants won 3 in 5 years w/o cheating lmao.
right......myself, I'm cubs/d-backs all the way brother.
well then idk why the hell you're defending them lmao.
@dingers4days14 said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@Buck_Mango said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@dingers4days14 said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@Buck_Mango said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
https://www.si.com/mlb/2020/01/23/sign-stealing-history-astros-red-sox
if you aint cheating you aint trying, cheating has been going on in sports since the inception of sports just sometimes people get caught. had they admitted to it, no worries water under the bridge.
It really must suck to be an Astros fan knowing that you barely won one title by cheating when the Giants won 3 in 5 years w/o cheating lmao.
right......myself, I'm cubs/d-backs all the way brother.
well then idk why the hell you're defending them lmao.
@dingers4days14 said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@Buck_Mango said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@dingers4days14 said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@Buck_Mango said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
https://www.si.com/mlb/2020/01/23/sign-stealing-history-astros-red-sox
if you aint cheating you aint trying, cheating has been going on in sports since the inception of sports just sometimes people get caught. had they admitted to it, no worries water under the bridge.
It really must suck to be an Astros fan knowing that you barely won one title by cheating when the Giants won 3 in 5 years w/o cheating lmao.
right......myself, I'm cubs/d-backs all the way brother.
well then idk why the hell you're defending them lmao.
@dingers4days14 said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@Buck_Mango said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@dingers4days14 said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@Buck_Mango said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
https://www.si.com/mlb/2020/01/23/sign-stealing-history-astros-red-sox
if you aint cheating you aint trying, cheating has been going on in sports since the inception of sports just sometimes people get caught. had they admitted to it, no worries water under the bridge.
It really must suck to be an Astros fan knowing that you barely won one title by cheating when the Giants won 3 in 5 years w/o cheating lmao.
right......myself, I'm cubs/d-backs all the way brother.
well then idk why the hell you're defending them lmao.
@dingers4days14 said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@Buck_Mango said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@dingers4days14 said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@Buck_Mango said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
https://www.si.com/mlb/2020/01/23/sign-stealing-history-astros-red-sox
if you aint cheating you aint trying, cheating has been going on in sports since the inception of sports just sometimes people get caught. had they admitted to it, no worries water under the bridge.
It really must suck to be an Astros fan knowing that you barely won one title by cheating when the Giants won 3 in 5 years w/o cheating lmao.
right......myself, I'm cubs/d-backs all the way brother.
well then idk why the hell you're defending them lmao.
@dingers4days14 said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@Buck_Mango said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@dingers4days14 said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@Buck_Mango said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
https://www.si.com/mlb/2020/01/23/sign-stealing-history-astros-red-sox
if you aint cheating you aint trying, cheating has been going on in sports since the inception of sports just sometimes people get caught. had they admitted to it, no worries water under the bridge.
It really must suck to be an Astros fan knowing that you barely won one title by cheating when the Giants won 3 in 5 years w/o cheating lmao.
right......myself, I'm cubs/d-backs all the way brother.
well then idk why the hell you're defending them lmao.
@dingers4days14 said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@Buck_Mango said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@dingers4days14 said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@Buck_Mango said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
https://www.si.com/mlb/2020/01/23/sign-stealing-history-astros-red-sox
if you aint cheating you aint trying, cheating has been going on in sports since the inception of sports just sometimes people get caught. had they admitted to it, no worries water under the bridge.
It really must suck to be an Astros fan knowing that you barely won one title by cheating when the Giants won 3 in 5 years w/o cheating lmao.
right......myself, I'm cubs/d-backs all the way brother.
well then idk why the hell you're defending them lmao.
@dingers4days14 said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@Buck_Mango said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@dingers4days14 said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@Buck_Mango said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
https://www.si.com/mlb/2020/01/23/sign-stealing-history-astros-red-sox
if you aint cheating you aint trying, cheating has been going on in sports since the inception of sports just sometimes people get caught. had they admitted to it, no worries water under the bridge.
It really must suck to be an Astros fan knowing that you barely won one title by cheating when the Giants won 3 in 5 years w/o cheating lmao.
right......myself, I'm cubs/d-backs all the way brother.
well then idk why the hell you're defending them lmao.
@dingers4days14 said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@Buck_Mango said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@dingers4days14 said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@Buck_Mango said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
https://www.si.com/mlb/2020/01/23/sign-stealing-history-astros-red-sox
if you aint cheating you aint trying, cheating has been going on in sports since the inception of sports just sometimes people get caught. had they admitted to it, no worries water under the bridge.
It really must suck to be an Astros fan knowing that you barely won one title by cheating when the Giants won 3 in 5 years w/o cheating lmao.
right......myself, I'm cubs/d-backs all the way brother.
well then idk why the hell you're defending them lmao.
@dingers4days14 said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@Buck_Mango said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@dingers4days14 said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@Buck_Mango said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
https://www.si.com/mlb/2020/01/23/sign-stealing-history-astros-red-sox
if you aint cheating you aint trying, cheating has been going on in sports since the inception of sports just sometimes people get caught. had they admitted to it, no worries water under the bridge.
It really must suck to be an Astros fan knowing that you barely won one title by cheating when the Giants won 3 in 5 years w/o cheating lmao.
right......myself, I'm cubs/d-backs all the way brother.
well then idk why the hell you're defending them lmao.
@dingers4days14 said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@Buck_Mango said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@dingers4days14 said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@Buck_Mango said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
https://www.si.com/mlb/2020/01/23/sign-stealing-history-astros-red-sox
if you aint cheating you aint trying, cheating has been going on in sports since the inception of sports just sometimes people get caught. had they admitted to it, no worries water under the bridge.
It really must suck to be an Astros fan knowing that you barely won one title by cheating when the Giants won 3 in 5 years w/o cheating lmao.
right......myself, I'm cubs/d-backs all the way brother.
well then idk why the hell you're defending them lmao.
@dingers4days14 said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@Buck_Mango said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@dingers4days14 said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@Buck_Mango said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
https://www.si.com/mlb/2020/01/23/sign-stealing-history-astros-red-sox
if you aint cheating you aint trying, cheating has been going on in sports since the inception of sports just sometimes people get caught. had they admitted to it, no worries water under the bridge.
It really must suck to be an Astros fan knowing that you barely won one title by cheating when the Giants won 3 in 5 years w/o cheating lmao.
right......myself, I'm cubs/d-backs all the way brother.
well then idk why the hell you're defending them lmao.
@dingers4days14 said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@Buck_Mango said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@dingers4days14 said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@Buck_Mango said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
https://www.si.com/mlb/2020/01/23/sign-stealing-history-astros-red-sox
if you aint cheating you aint trying, cheating has been going on in sports since the inception of sports just sometimes people get caught. had they admitted to it, no worries water under the bridge.
It really must suck to be an Astros fan knowing that you barely won one title by cheating when the Giants won 3 in 5 years w/o cheating lmao.
right......myself, I'm cubs/d-backs all the way brother.
well then idk why the hell you're defending them lmao.
no one
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Them cheating is only half of the problem. My biggest issue was how arrogant they were when denying the cheating. How they made it seem like other teams were crazy for calling them out. Especially Correa, I think that smug SOB deserves everything that’s coming to him. Look at Altuve batting under .200. Hard to hit when ya don’t know what’s coming huh
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@Buck_Mango said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@NCStateHokie said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@Buck_Mango said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@dbarmonstar said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@Buck_Mango said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@dbarmonstar said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@Buck_Mango said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
https://www.si.com/mlb/2020/01/23/sign-stealing-history-astros-red-sox
if you aint cheating you aint trying, cheating has been going on in sports since the inception of sports just sometimes people get caught. had they admitted to it, no worries water under the bridge.
Difference with the Astros it was a whole team. in the past at least it has been players majority of the time, Even the Black sox scandal was not the whole team just some players. They got severely punished. the issue here is players got away with the cheating and the team still keeps the title. The way Manfred handled this is the real problem. The way the Astros players are acting this year is disrespectful.
they just got caught, this didn't end all cheating- deep down a lot of people are thinking "dang why didn't we think of that"- I loathe the Astros, they've always been overly arrogant s.o.b.'s in my opinion, I'm just pointing out truth now we know why they were "overly arrogant"
Yeah they did get caught and what was done, nothing nothing at all to the players. That is the real problem, No one is saying others are not cheating, do not use that as an excuse that others did not get caught so it was ok for the Astros players to get away with it. Manfred is a tool. If this is how Manfred wants to be then Pete Rose should be re instated and Joe Jackson should be in the hall of fame if cheating does not matter cause everyone does it mentality.
when I was a little leaguer back in '83 I listed Pete Rose as my favorite baseball player, I hear ya- too much hypocrisy period. Barry Bonds was hands down the greatest player to play the game, he could recognize a pitch before it left the pitchers hand- steroids didn't help him do that, steroids didn't give bonds "super eyes", he truly is a Giant. Roger Clemens just did what everyone else was doing at the time and kept doing what he did shutting them down. Sometimes in your mind you're like " well [censored] if they're doing it and not getting busted and its making those scrubs better I may as well do it too, I aint a snitch and I know if its making your scrub zzz better I'm dominating". Bonds and Clemens are first ballot, Bonds was a [censored] to the media, tell me how steroids helped him finish with an on base percentage over .500 for 4 straight years- between the ages of 36-39 when most couldn't remember their prime, steroids didn't do that the greatest eye in baseball did that.
I know you're a troll so this is the only thing I'll say about this but I'm guessing you accidentally left out the part where steroids help you bulk up. While he certainly had a great eye (and I agree that steroids had very little to do with that) when you have arms the size of most grown men's thighs then your bat speed and power just might get a little boost. I remember he got walked with the bases loaded a time or two. Pitchers/managers walked him so much on purpose because of the sheer power that man had. Steroids most definitely provide an advantage to those that take them.
In 2004 he had an other worldly .609 OBP. He was walked 232 times, 120 of those intentionally and I bet quite a few of the other 112 were intentionally unintentional.
so he was the strongest dude that ever lived, that's your argument basically, being the strongest dude ever with the greatest eye means you should be in the hall. Bonds was the best player before steroids(https://www.baseball-reference.com/players/b/bondsba01.shtml) he became the best steroid user then- dude 90% of all players were using in that era, bonds became the best because he already was the best- Barry Bonds is the greatest baseball player of any generation regardless of steroids, you've never played the game if you don't get that. Barry Bonds is baseballs g.o.a.t, hank 2nd, babe 3rd hands down- ask anyone who faced Bonds. mark McGwire was a known user and no one feared him like they feared bonds, look at the numbers dude and McGwire was the closest thing to bonds as a power threat in that era next to Sammy.
The only argument you have with PEDs (steroids) is just that... performance enhancing. Think about it. People on here talk about monitors, input lag, response time, and all that stuff all the time, but you still have to put the PCI in the right spot.
You’re right in saying steroids didn’t help his hand-eye coordination, or see the pitches easier. But if you’re developing explosive muscle through the use of that junk, it’s definitely going to help your bat and hands get through the zone with higher velocity.
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@Buck_Mango said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@jz2016cubs said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@Buck_Mango said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@jz2016cubs said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
I am VERY surprised that:
- This thread hasn't been moved from Diamond Dynasty
- That this thread hasn't been deleted
I was at "Mother's Bar" in Ocean Beach San Diego the night the Cubbies won in '16, paid a girl $100 to take my shift so I could watch the game- next to watching Sammy hit homers #60, 61 and 62 in person September 12-13 1998 against Milwaukee it was the greatest baseball experience of my life.
That is cool. But how does this matter?
@Trevor-Story Agreedit doesn't, just sayin
OH, Got it.
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@Buck_Mango said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@dingers4days14 said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@Buck_Mango said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@dingers4days14 said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@Buck_Mango said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
https://www.si.com/mlb/2020/01/23/sign-stealing-history-astros-red-sox
if you aint cheating you aint trying, cheating has been going on in sports since the inception of sports just sometimes people get caught. had they admitted to it, no worries water under the bridge.
It really must suck to be an Astros fan knowing that you barely won one title by cheating when the Giants won 3 in 5 years w/o cheating lmao.
right......myself, I'm cubs/d-backs all the way brother.
well then idk why the hell you're defending them lmao.
@dingers4days14 said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@Buck_Mango said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@dingers4days14 said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@Buck_Mango said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
https://www.si.com/mlb/2020/01/23/sign-stealing-history-astros-red-sox
if you aint cheating you aint trying, cheating has been going on in sports since the inception of sports just sometimes people get caught. had they admitted to it, no worries water under the bridge.
It really must suck to be an Astros fan knowing that you barely won one title by cheating when the Giants won 3 in 5 years w/o cheating lmao.
right......myself, I'm cubs/d-backs all the way brother.
well then idk why the hell you're defending them lmao.
@dingers4days14 said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@Buck_Mango said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@dingers4days14 said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@Buck_Mango said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
https://www.si.com/mlb/2020/01/23/sign-stealing-history-astros-red-sox
if you aint cheating you aint trying, cheating has been going on in sports since the inception of sports just sometimes people get caught. had they admitted to it, no worries water under the bridge.
It really must suck to be an Astros fan knowing that you barely won one title by cheating when the Giants won 3 in 5 years w/o cheating lmao.
right......myself, I'm cubs/d-backs all the way brother.
well then idk why the hell you're defending them lmao.
@dingers4days14 said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@Buck_Mango said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@dingers4days14 said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@Buck_Mango said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
https://www.si.com/mlb/2020/01/23/sign-stealing-history-astros-red-sox
if you aint cheating you aint trying, cheating has been going on in sports since the inception of sports just sometimes people get caught. had they admitted to it, no worries water under the bridge.
It really must suck to be an Astros fan knowing that you barely won one title by cheating when the Giants won 3 in 5 years w/o cheating lmao.
right......myself, I'm cubs/d-backs all the way brother.
well then idk why the hell you're defending them lmao.
@dingers4days14 said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@Buck_Mango said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@dingers4days14 said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@Buck_Mango said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
https://www.si.com/mlb/2020/01/23/sign-stealing-history-astros-red-sox
if you aint cheating you aint trying, cheating has been going on in sports since the inception of sports just sometimes people get caught. had they admitted to it, no worries water under the bridge.
It really must suck to be an Astros fan knowing that you barely won one title by cheating when the Giants won 3 in 5 years w/o cheating lmao.
right......myself, I'm cubs/d-backs all the way brother.
well then idk why the hell you're defending them lmao.
@dingers4days14 said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@Buck_Mango said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@dingers4days14 said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@Buck_Mango said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
https://www.si.com/mlb/2020/01/23/sign-stealing-history-astros-red-sox
if you aint cheating you aint trying, cheating has been going on in sports since the inception of sports just sometimes people get caught. had they admitted to it, no worries water under the bridge.
It really must suck to be an Astros fan knowing that you barely won one title by cheating when the Giants won 3 in 5 years w/o cheating lmao.
right......myself, I'm cubs/d-backs all the way brother.
well then idk why the hell you're defending them lmao.
@dingers4days14 said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@Buck_Mango said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@dingers4days14 said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@Buck_Mango said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
https://www.si.com/mlb/2020/01/23/sign-stealing-history-astros-red-sox
if you aint cheating you aint trying, cheating has been going on in sports since the inception of sports just sometimes people get caught. had they admitted to it, no worries water under the bridge.
It really must suck to be an Astros fan knowing that you barely won one title by cheating when the Giants won 3 in 5 years w/o cheating lmao.
right......myself, I'm cubs/d-backs all the way brother.
well then idk why the hell you're defending them lmao.
@dingers4days14 said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@Buck_Mango said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@dingers4days14 said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@Buck_Mango said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
https://www.si.com/mlb/2020/01/23/sign-stealing-history-astros-red-sox
if you aint cheating you aint trying, cheating has been going on in sports since the inception of sports just sometimes people get caught. had they admitted to it, no worries water under the bridge.
It really must suck to be an Astros fan knowing that you barely won one title by cheating when the Giants won 3 in 5 years w/o cheating lmao.
right......myself, I'm cubs/d-backs all the way brother.
well then idk why the hell you're defending them lmao.
@dingers4days14 said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@Buck_Mango said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@dingers4days14 said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@Buck_Mango said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
https://www.si.com/mlb/2020/01/23/sign-stealing-history-astros-red-sox
if you aint cheating you aint trying, cheating has been going on in sports since the inception of sports just sometimes people get caught. had they admitted to it, no worries water under the bridge.
It really must suck to be an Astros fan knowing that you barely won one title by cheating when the Giants won 3 in 5 years w/o cheating lmao.
right......myself, I'm cubs/d-backs all the way brother.
well then idk why the hell you're defending them lmao.
@dingers4days14 said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@Buck_Mango said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@dingers4days14 said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@Buck_Mango said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
https://www.si.com/mlb/2020/01/23/sign-stealing-history-astros-red-sox
if you aint cheating you aint trying, cheating has been going on in sports since the inception of sports just sometimes people get caught. had they admitted to it, no worries water under the bridge.
It really must suck to be an Astros fan knowing that you barely won one title by cheating when the Giants won 3 in 5 years w/o cheating lmao.
right......myself, I'm cubs/d-backs all the way brother.
well then idk why the hell you're defending them lmao.
@dingers4days14 said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@Buck_Mango said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@dingers4days14 said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@Buck_Mango said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
https://www.si.com/mlb/2020/01/23/sign-stealing-history-astros-red-sox
if you aint cheating you aint trying, cheating has been going on in sports since the inception of sports just sometimes people get caught. had they admitted to it, no worries water under the bridge.
It really must suck to be an Astros fan knowing that you barely won one title by cheating when the Giants won 3 in 5 years w/o cheating lmao.
right......myself, I'm cubs/d-backs all the way brother.
well then idk why the hell you're defending them lmao.
@dingers4days14 said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@Buck_Mango said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@dingers4days14 said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@Buck_Mango said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
https://www.si.com/mlb/2020/01/23/sign-stealing-history-astros-red-sox
if you aint cheating you aint trying, cheating has been going on in sports since the inception of sports just sometimes people get caught. had they admitted to it, no worries water under the bridge.
It really must suck to be an Astros fan knowing that you barely won one title by cheating when the Giants won 3 in 5 years w/o cheating lmao.
right......myself, I'm cubs/d-backs all the way brother.
well then idk why the hell you're defending them lmao.
@dingers4days14 said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@Buck_Mango said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@dingers4days14 said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@Buck_Mango said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
https://www.si.com/mlb/2020/01/23/sign-stealing-history-astros-red-sox
if you aint cheating you aint trying, cheating has been going on in sports since the inception of sports just sometimes people get caught. had they admitted to it, no worries water under the bridge.
It really must suck to be an Astros fan knowing that you barely won one title by cheating when the Giants won 3 in 5 years w/o cheating lmao.
right......myself, I'm cubs/d-backs all the way brother.
well then idk why the hell you're defending them lmao.
no one
wtf you're tripping
-
@dingers4days14 said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@Buck_Mango said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@dingers4days14 said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@Buck_Mango said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@dingers4days14 said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@Buck_Mango said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
https://www.si.com/mlb/2020/01/23/sign-stealing-history-astros-red-sox
if you aint cheating you aint trying, cheating has been going on in sports since the inception of sports just sometimes people get caught. had they admitted to it, no worries water under the bridge.
It really must suck to be an Astros fan knowing that you barely won one title by cheating when the Giants won 3 in 5 years w/o cheating lmao.
right......myself, I'm cubs/d-backs all the way brother.
well then idk why the hell you're defending them lmao.
@dingers4days14 said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@Buck_Mango said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@dingers4days14 said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@Buck_Mango said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
https://www.si.com/mlb/2020/01/23/sign-stealing-history-astros-red-sox
if you aint cheating you aint trying, cheating has been going on in sports since the inception of sports just sometimes people get caught. had they admitted to it, no worries water under the bridge.
It really must suck to be an Astros fan knowing that you barely won one title by cheating when the Giants won 3 in 5 years w/o cheating lmao.
right......myself, I'm cubs/d-backs all the way brother.
well then idk why the hell you're defending them lmao.
@dingers4days14 said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@Buck_Mango said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@dingers4days14 said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@Buck_Mango said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
https://www.si.com/mlb/2020/01/23/sign-stealing-history-astros-red-sox
if you aint cheating you aint trying, cheating has been going on in sports since the inception of sports just sometimes people get caught. had they admitted to it, no worries water under the bridge.
It really must suck to be an Astros fan knowing that you barely won one title by cheating when the Giants won 3 in 5 years w/o cheating lmao.
right......myself, I'm cubs/d-backs all the way brother.
well then idk why the hell you're defending them lmao.
@dingers4days14 said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@Buck_Mango said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@dingers4days14 said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@Buck_Mango said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
https://www.si.com/mlb/2020/01/23/sign-stealing-history-astros-red-sox
if you aint cheating you aint trying, cheating has been going on in sports since the inception of sports just sometimes people get caught. had they admitted to it, no worries water under the bridge.
It really must suck to be an Astros fan knowing that you barely won one title by cheating when the Giants won 3 in 5 years w/o cheating lmao.
right......myself, I'm cubs/d-backs all the way brother.
well then idk why the hell you're defending them lmao.
@dingers4days14 said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@Buck_Mango said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@dingers4days14 said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@Buck_Mango said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
https://www.si.com/mlb/2020/01/23/sign-stealing-history-astros-red-sox
if you aint cheating you aint trying, cheating has been going on in sports since the inception of sports just sometimes people get caught. had they admitted to it, no worries water under the bridge.
It really must suck to be an Astros fan knowing that you barely won one title by cheating when the Giants won 3 in 5 years w/o cheating lmao.
right......myself, I'm cubs/d-backs all the way brother.
well then idk why the hell you're defending them lmao.
@dingers4days14 said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@Buck_Mango said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@dingers4days14 said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@Buck_Mango said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
https://www.si.com/mlb/2020/01/23/sign-stealing-history-astros-red-sox
if you aint cheating you aint trying, cheating has been going on in sports since the inception of sports just sometimes people get caught. had they admitted to it, no worries water under the bridge.
It really must suck to be an Astros fan knowing that you barely won one title by cheating when the Giants won 3 in 5 years w/o cheating lmao.
right......myself, I'm cubs/d-backs all the way brother.
well then idk why the hell you're defending them lmao.
@dingers4days14 said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@Buck_Mango said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@dingers4days14 said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@Buck_Mango said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
https://www.si.com/mlb/2020/01/23/sign-stealing-history-astros-red-sox
if you aint cheating you aint trying, cheating has been going on in sports since the inception of sports just sometimes people get caught. had they admitted to it, no worries water under the bridge.
It really must suck to be an Astros fan knowing that you barely won one title by cheating when the Giants won 3 in 5 years w/o cheating lmao.
right......myself, I'm cubs/d-backs all the way brother.
well then idk why the hell you're defending them lmao.
@dingers4days14 said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@Buck_Mango said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@dingers4days14 said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@Buck_Mango said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
https://www.si.com/mlb/2020/01/23/sign-stealing-history-astros-red-sox
if you aint cheating you aint trying, cheating has been going on in sports since the inception of sports just sometimes people get caught. had they admitted to it, no worries water under the bridge.
It really must suck to be an Astros fan knowing that you barely won one title by cheating when the Giants won 3 in 5 years w/o cheating lmao.
right......myself, I'm cubs/d-backs all the way brother.
well then idk why the hell you're defending them lmao.
@dingers4days14 said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@Buck_Mango said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@dingers4days14 said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@Buck_Mango said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
https://www.si.com/mlb/2020/01/23/sign-stealing-history-astros-red-sox
if you aint cheating you aint trying, cheating has been going on in sports since the inception of sports just sometimes people get caught. had they admitted to it, no worries water under the bridge.
It really must suck to be an Astros fan knowing that you barely won one title by cheating when the Giants won 3 in 5 years w/o cheating lmao.
right......myself, I'm cubs/d-backs all the way brother.
well then idk why the hell you're defending them lmao.
@dingers4days14 said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@Buck_Mango said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@dingers4days14 said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@Buck_Mango said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
https://www.si.com/mlb/2020/01/23/sign-stealing-history-astros-red-sox
if you aint cheating you aint trying, cheating has been going on in sports since the inception of sports just sometimes people get caught. had they admitted to it, no worries water under the bridge.
It really must suck to be an Astros fan knowing that you barely won one title by cheating when the Giants won 3 in 5 years w/o cheating lmao.
right......myself, I'm cubs/d-backs all the way brother.
well then idk why the hell you're defending them lmao.
@dingers4days14 said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@Buck_Mango said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@dingers4days14 said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@Buck_Mango said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
https://www.si.com/mlb/2020/01/23/sign-stealing-history-astros-red-sox
if you aint cheating you aint trying, cheating has been going on in sports since the inception of sports just sometimes people get caught. had they admitted to it, no worries water under the bridge.
It really must suck to be an Astros fan knowing that you barely won one title by cheating when the Giants won 3 in 5 years w/o cheating lmao.
right......myself, I'm cubs/d-backs all the way brother.
well then idk why the hell you're defending them lmao.
@dingers4days14 said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@Buck_Mango said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@dingers4days14 said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@Buck_Mango said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
https://www.si.com/mlb/2020/01/23/sign-stealing-history-astros-red-sox
if you aint cheating you aint trying, cheating has been going on in sports since the inception of sports just sometimes people get caught. had they admitted to it, no worries water under the bridge.
It really must suck to be an Astros fan knowing that you barely won one title by cheating when the Giants won 3 in 5 years w/o cheating lmao.
right......myself, I'm cubs/d-backs all the way brother.
well then idk why the hell you're defending them lmao.
@dingers4days14 said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@Buck_Mango said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@dingers4days14 said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@Buck_Mango said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
https://www.si.com/mlb/2020/01/23/sign-stealing-history-astros-red-sox
if you aint cheating you aint trying, cheating has been going on in sports since the inception of sports just sometimes people get caught. had they admitted to it, no worries water under the bridge.
It really must suck to be an Astros fan knowing that you barely won one title by cheating when the Giants won 3 in 5 years w/o cheating lmao.
right......myself, I'm cubs/d-backs all the way brother.
well then idk why the hell you're defending them lmao.
no one
wtf you're tripping
mouse got stuck
-
@NCStateHokie said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@Buck_Mango said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@dbarmonstar said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@Buck_Mango said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@dbarmonstar said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@Buck_Mango said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
https://www.si.com/mlb/2020/01/23/sign-stealing-history-astros-red-sox
if you aint cheating you aint trying, cheating has been going on in sports since the inception of sports just sometimes people get caught. had they admitted to it, no worries water under the bridge.
Difference with the Astros it was a whole team. in the past at least it has been players majority of the time, Even the Black sox scandal was not the whole team just some players. They got severely punished. the issue here is players got away with the cheating and the team still keeps the title. The way Manfred handled this is the real problem. The way the Astros players are acting this year is disrespectful.
they just got caught, this didn't end all cheating- deep down a lot of people are thinking "dang why didn't we think of that"- I loathe the Astros, they've always been overly arrogant s.o.b.'s in my opinion, I'm just pointing out truth now we know why they were "overly arrogant"
Yeah they did get caught and what was done, nothing nothing at all to the players. That is the real problem, No one is saying others are not cheating, do not use that as an excuse that others did not get caught so it was ok for the Astros players to get away with it. Manfred is a tool. If this is how Manfred wants to be then Pete Rose should be re instated and Joe Jackson should be in the hall of fame if cheating does not matter cause everyone does it mentality.
when I was a little leaguer back in '83 I listed Pete Rose as my favorite baseball player, I hear ya- too much hypocrisy period. Barry Bonds was hands down the greatest player to play the game, he could recognize a pitch before it left the pitchers hand- steroids didn't help him do that, steroids didn't give bonds "super eyes", he truly is a Giant. Roger Clemens just did what everyone else was doing at the time and kept doing what he did shutting them down. Sometimes in your mind you're like " well [censored] if they're doing it and not getting busted and its making those scrubs better I may as well do it too, I aint a snitch and I know if its making your scrub zzz better I'm dominating". Bonds and Clemens are first ballot, Bonds was a [censored] to the media, tell me how steroids helped him finish with an on base percentage over .500 for 4 straight years- between the ages of 36-39 when most couldn't remember their prime, steroids didn't do that the greatest eye in baseball did that.
I know you're a troll so this is the only thing I'll say about this but I'm guessing you accidentally left out the part where steroids help you bulk up. While he certainly had a great eye (and I agree that steroids had very little to do with that) when you have arms the size of most grown men's thighs then your bat speed and power just might get a little boost. I remember he got walked with the bases loaded a time or two. Pitchers/managers walked him so much on purpose because of the sheer power that man had. Steroids most definitely provide an advantage to those that take them.
In 2004 he had an other worldly .609 OBP. He was walked 232 times, 120 of those intentionally and I bet quite a few of the other 112 were intentionally unintentional.
Barry got some help from the juice there’s no doubt. The main area he got help in was the ability to recover and stay healthy. Did it make him stronger, sure it did. But you’re still hitting a round ball, with a round bat, coming at you at 100mph. Hardest thing to do in professional sports. Barry was a world class hitter before the juice. I DO NOT for one second believe his increase in strength was the reason he hit more bombs. I believe it was a combination of Barry’s next level patience, and his next level skill. Neither of which any player in the league possess today. He might.....I repeat might, see one pitch to hit per game and for about a 4 year run, he never missed.......or very rarely! We will NEVER see that type of skill and production ever again!!! The Astros couldn’t hit like Barry and they cheated!!
-
@wingo18 said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@Buck_Mango said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@NCStateHokie said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@Buck_Mango said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@dbarmonstar said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@Buck_Mango said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@dbarmonstar said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@Buck_Mango said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
https://www.si.com/mlb/2020/01/23/sign-stealing-history-astros-red-sox
if you aint cheating you aint trying, cheating has been going on in sports since the inception of sports just sometimes people get caught. had they admitted to it, no worries water under the bridge.
Difference with the Astros it was a whole team. in the past at least it has been players majority of the time, Even the Black sox scandal was not the whole team just some players. They got severely punished. the issue here is players got away with the cheating and the team still keeps the title. The way Manfred handled this is the real problem. The way the Astros players are acting this year is disrespectful.
they just got caught, this didn't end all cheating- deep down a lot of people are thinking "dang why didn't we think of that"- I loathe the Astros, they've always been overly arrogant s.o.b.'s in my opinion, I'm just pointing out truth now we know why they were "overly arrogant"
Yeah they did get caught and what was done, nothing nothing at all to the players. That is the real problem, No one is saying others are not cheating, do not use that as an excuse that others did not get caught so it was ok for the Astros players to get away with it. Manfred is a tool. If this is how Manfred wants to be then Pete Rose should be re instated and Joe Jackson should be in the hall of fame if cheating does not matter cause everyone does it mentality.
when I was a little leaguer back in '83 I listed Pete Rose as my favorite baseball player, I hear ya- too much hypocrisy period. Barry Bonds was hands down the greatest player to play the game, he could recognize a pitch before it left the pitchers hand- steroids didn't help him do that, steroids didn't give bonds "super eyes", he truly is a Giant. Roger Clemens just did what everyone else was doing at the time and kept doing what he did shutting them down. Sometimes in your mind you're like " well [censored] if they're doing it and not getting busted and its making those scrubs better I may as well do it too, I aint a snitch and I know if its making your scrub zzz better I'm dominating". Bonds and Clemens are first ballot, Bonds was a [censored] to the media, tell me how steroids helped him finish with an on base percentage over .500 for 4 straight years- between the ages of 36-39 when most couldn't remember their prime, steroids didn't do that the greatest eye in baseball did that.
I know you're a troll so this is the only thing I'll say about this but I'm guessing you accidentally left out the part where steroids help you bulk up. While he certainly had a great eye (and I agree that steroids had very little to do with that) when you have arms the size of most grown men's thighs then your bat speed and power just might get a little boost. I remember he got walked with the bases loaded a time or two. Pitchers/managers walked him so much on purpose because of the sheer power that man had. Steroids most definitely provide an advantage to those that take them.
In 2004 he had an other worldly .609 OBP. He was walked 232 times, 120 of those intentionally and I bet quite a few of the other 112 were intentionally unintentional.
so he was the strongest dude that ever lived, that's your argument basically, being the strongest dude ever with the greatest eye means you should be in the hall. Bonds was the best player before steroids(https://www.baseball-reference.com/players/b/bondsba01.shtml) he became the best steroid user then- dude 90% of all players were using in that era, bonds became the best because he already was the best- Barry Bonds is the greatest baseball player of any generation regardless of steroids, you've never played the game if you don't get that. Barry Bonds is baseballs g.o.a.t, hank 2nd, babe 3rd hands down- ask anyone who faced Bonds. mark McGwire was a known user and no one feared him like they feared bonds, look at the numbers dude and McGwire was the closest thing to bonds as a power threat in that era next to Sammy.
The only argument you have with PEDs (steroids) is just that... performance enhancing. Think about it. People on here talk about monitors, input lag, response time, and all that stuff all the time, but you still have to put the PCI in the right spot.
You’re right in saying steroids didn’t help his hand-eye coordination, or see the pitches easier. But if you’re developing explosive muscle through the use of that junk, it’s definitely going to help your bat and hands get through the zone with higher velocity.
Bonds was several levels higher than any other steroid user in that era, no ones numbers come close minus a-rod and Pujols but even they were a few steps under Bonds. Pitchers throwing at Bonds were using-not all but more than 75% and he made 'em all look stupid way more than any other player of that era. Bonds stood above players before steroids, he stood even higher above with steroids against competition that was using it against him- Bonds is baseballs g.o.a.t. hands down- hank is second(how many know or realize Hank Aaron has the 3rd most hits of any player in mlb)
-
Remember when the Houston Strong thing was in effect? So sad they wasted that tremendous emotional moment by cheating.
I mean, I only hated them in 1986 because Mike Scott was looming in game 7 back then.
Just an American tragedy. I'm pissed at them, but I dont hate them. -
@mjfc_363 said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@NCStateHokie said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@Buck_Mango said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@dbarmonstar said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@Buck_Mango said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@dbarmonstar said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@Buck_Mango said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
https://www.si.com/mlb/2020/01/23/sign-stealing-history-astros-red-sox
if you aint cheating you aint trying, cheating has been going on in sports since the inception of sports just sometimes people get caught. had they admitted to it, no worries water under the bridge.
Difference with the Astros it was a whole team. in the past at least it has been players majority of the time, Even the Black sox scandal was not the whole team just some players. They got severely punished. the issue here is players got away with the cheating and the team still keeps the title. The way Manfred handled this is the real problem. The way the Astros players are acting this year is disrespectful.
they just got caught, this didn't end all cheating- deep down a lot of people are thinking "dang why didn't we think of that"- I loathe the Astros, they've always been overly arrogant s.o.b.'s in my opinion, I'm just pointing out truth now we know why they were "overly arrogant"
Yeah they did get caught and what was done, nothing nothing at all to the players. That is the real problem, No one is saying others are not cheating, do not use that as an excuse that others did not get caught so it was ok for the Astros players to get away with it. Manfred is a tool. If this is how Manfred wants to be then Pete Rose should be re instated and Joe Jackson should be in the hall of fame if cheating does not matter cause everyone does it mentality.
when I was a little leaguer back in '83 I listed Pete Rose as my favorite baseball player, I hear ya- too much hypocrisy period. Barry Bonds was hands down the greatest player to play the game, he could recognize a pitch before it left the pitchers hand- steroids didn't help him do that, steroids didn't give bonds "super eyes", he truly is a Giant. Roger Clemens just did what everyone else was doing at the time and kept doing what he did shutting them down. Sometimes in your mind you're like " well [censored] if they're doing it and not getting busted and its making those scrubs better I may as well do it too, I aint a snitch and I know if its making your scrub zzz better I'm dominating". Bonds and Clemens are first ballot, Bonds was a [censored] to the media, tell me how steroids helped him finish with an on base percentage over .500 for 4 straight years- between the ages of 36-39 when most couldn't remember their prime, steroids didn't do that the greatest eye in baseball did that.
I know you're a troll so this is the only thing I'll say about this but I'm guessing you accidentally left out the part where steroids help you bulk up. While he certainly had a great eye (and I agree that steroids had very little to do with that) when you have arms the size of most grown men's thighs then your bat speed and power just might get a little boost. I remember he got walked with the bases loaded a time or two. Pitchers/managers walked him so much on purpose because of the sheer power that man had. Steroids most definitely provide an advantage to those that take them.
In 2004 he had an other worldly .609 OBP. He was walked 232 times, 120 of those intentionally and I bet quite a few of the other 112 were intentionally unintentional.
Barry got some help from the juice there’s no doubt. The main area he got help in was the ability to recover and stay healthy. Did it make him stronger, sure it did. But you’re still hitting a round ball, with a round bat, coming at you at 100mph. Hardest thing to do in professional sports. Barry was a world class hitter before the juice. I DO NOT for one second believe his increase in strength was the reason he hit more bombs. I believe it was a combination of Barry’s next level patience, and his next level skill. Neither of which any player in the league possess today. He might.....I repeat might, see one pitch to hit per game and for about a 4 year run, he never missed.......or very rarely! We will NEVER see that type of skill and production ever again!!! The Astros couldn’t hit like Barry and they cheated!!
Barry=MLB G.O.A.T., well spoken.
-
@Buck_Mango said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@wingo18 said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@Buck_Mango said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@NCStateHokie said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@Buck_Mango said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@dbarmonstar said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@Buck_Mango said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@dbarmonstar said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@Buck_Mango said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
https://www.si.com/mlb/2020/01/23/sign-stealing-history-astros-red-sox
if you aint cheating you aint trying, cheating has been going on in sports since the inception of sports just sometimes people get caught. had they admitted to it, no worries water under the bridge.
Difference with the Astros it was a whole team. in the past at least it has been players majority of the time, Even the Black sox scandal was not the whole team just some players. They got severely punished. the issue here is players got away with the cheating and the team still keeps the title. The way Manfred handled this is the real problem. The way the Astros players are acting this year is disrespectful.
they just got caught, this didn't end all cheating- deep down a lot of people are thinking "dang why didn't we think of that"- I loathe the Astros, they've always been overly arrogant s.o.b.'s in my opinion, I'm just pointing out truth now we know why they were "overly arrogant"
Yeah they did get caught and what was done, nothing nothing at all to the players. That is the real problem, No one is saying others are not cheating, do not use that as an excuse that others did not get caught so it was ok for the Astros players to get away with it. Manfred is a tool. If this is how Manfred wants to be then Pete Rose should be re instated and Joe Jackson should be in the hall of fame if cheating does not matter cause everyone does it mentality.
when I was a little leaguer back in '83 I listed Pete Rose as my favorite baseball player, I hear ya- too much hypocrisy period. Barry Bonds was hands down the greatest player to play the game, he could recognize a pitch before it left the pitchers hand- steroids didn't help him do that, steroids didn't give bonds "super eyes", he truly is a Giant. Roger Clemens just did what everyone else was doing at the time and kept doing what he did shutting them down. Sometimes in your mind you're like " well [censored] if they're doing it and not getting busted and its making those scrubs better I may as well do it too, I aint a snitch and I know if its making your scrub zzz better I'm dominating". Bonds and Clemens are first ballot, Bonds was a [censored] to the media, tell me how steroids helped him finish with an on base percentage over .500 for 4 straight years- between the ages of 36-39 when most couldn't remember their prime, steroids didn't do that the greatest eye in baseball did that.
I know you're a troll so this is the only thing I'll say about this but I'm guessing you accidentally left out the part where steroids help you bulk up. While he certainly had a great eye (and I agree that steroids had very little to do with that) when you have arms the size of most grown men's thighs then your bat speed and power just might get a little boost. I remember he got walked with the bases loaded a time or two. Pitchers/managers walked him so much on purpose because of the sheer power that man had. Steroids most definitely provide an advantage to those that take them.
In 2004 he had an other worldly .609 OBP. He was walked 232 times, 120 of those intentionally and I bet quite a few of the other 112 were intentionally unintentional.
so he was the strongest dude that ever lived, that's your argument basically, being the strongest dude ever with the greatest eye means you should be in the hall. Bonds was the best player before steroids(https://www.baseball-reference.com/players/b/bondsba01.shtml) he became the best steroid user then- dude 90% of all players were using in that era, bonds became the best because he already was the best- Barry Bonds is the greatest baseball player of any generation regardless of steroids, you've never played the game if you don't get that. Barry Bonds is baseballs g.o.a.t, hank 2nd, babe 3rd hands down- ask anyone who faced Bonds. mark McGwire was a known user and no one feared him like they feared bonds, look at the numbers dude and McGwire was the closest thing to bonds as a power threat in that era next to Sammy.
The only argument you have with PEDs (steroids) is just that... performance enhancing. Think about it. People on here talk about monitors, input lag, response time, and all that stuff all the time, but you still have to put the PCI in the right spot.
You’re right in saying steroids didn’t help his hand-eye coordination, or see the pitches easier. But if you’re developing explosive muscle through the use of that junk, it’s definitely going to help your bat and hands get through the zone with higher velocity.
Bonds was several levels higher than any other steroid user in that era, no ones numbers come close minus a-rod and Pujols but even they were a few steps under Bonds. Pitchers throwing at Bonds were using-not all but more than 75% and he made 'em all look stupid way more than any other player of that era. Bonds stood above players before steroids, he stood even higher above with steroids against competition that was using it against him- Bonds is baseballs g.o.a.t. hands down- hank is second(how many know or realize Hank Aaron has the 3rd most hits of any player in mlb)
Yes, you've hammered that notion into the ground. But there is no denying that steroid use helped him develop and keep the physical ability to have an advantage in actually getting his bat through the zone, correct?
And that's why there's an asterisk next to his name
-
@Buck_Mango said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@wingo18 said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@Buck_Mango said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@NCStateHokie said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@Buck_Mango said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@dbarmonstar said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@Buck_Mango said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@dbarmonstar said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@Buck_Mango said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
https://www.si.com/mlb/2020/01/23/sign-stealing-history-astros-red-sox
if you aint cheating you aint trying, cheating has been going on in sports since the inception of sports just sometimes people get caught. had they admitted to it, no worries water under the bridge.
Difference with the Astros it was a whole team. in the past at least it has been players majority of the time, Even the Black sox scandal was not the whole team just some players. They got severely punished. the issue here is players got away with the cheating and the team still keeps the title. The way Manfred handled this is the real problem. The way the Astros players are acting this year is disrespectful.
they just got caught, this didn't end all cheating- deep down a lot of people are thinking "dang why didn't we think of that"- I loathe the Astros, they've always been overly arrogant s.o.b.'s in my opinion, I'm just pointing out truth now we know why they were "overly arrogant"
Yeah they did get caught and what was done, nothing nothing at all to the players. That is the real problem, No one is saying others are not cheating, do not use that as an excuse that others did not get caught so it was ok for the Astros players to get away with it. Manfred is a tool. If this is how Manfred wants to be then Pete Rose should be re instated and Joe Jackson should be in the hall of fame if cheating does not matter cause everyone does it mentality.
when I was a little leaguer back in '83 I listed Pete Rose as my favorite baseball player, I hear ya- too much hypocrisy period. Barry Bonds was hands down the greatest player to play the game, he could recognize a pitch before it left the pitchers hand- steroids didn't help him do that, steroids didn't give bonds "super eyes", he truly is a Giant. Roger Clemens just did what everyone else was doing at the time and kept doing what he did shutting them down. Sometimes in your mind you're like " well [censored] if they're doing it and not getting busted and its making those scrubs better I may as well do it too, I aint a snitch and I know if its making your scrub zzz better I'm dominating". Bonds and Clemens are first ballot, Bonds was a [censored] to the media, tell me how steroids helped him finish with an on base percentage over .500 for 4 straight years- between the ages of 36-39 when most couldn't remember their prime, steroids didn't do that the greatest eye in baseball did that.
I know you're a troll so this is the only thing I'll say about this but I'm guessing you accidentally left out the part where steroids help you bulk up. While he certainly had a great eye (and I agree that steroids had very little to do with that) when you have arms the size of most grown men's thighs then your bat speed and power just might get a little boost. I remember he got walked with the bases loaded a time or two. Pitchers/managers walked him so much on purpose because of the sheer power that man had. Steroids most definitely provide an advantage to those that take them.
In 2004 he had an other worldly .609 OBP. He was walked 232 times, 120 of those intentionally and I bet quite a few of the other 112 were intentionally unintentional.
so he was the strongest dude that ever lived, that's your argument basically, being the strongest dude ever with the greatest eye means you should be in the hall. Bonds was the best player before steroids(https://www.baseball-reference.com/players/b/bondsba01.shtml) he became the best steroid user then- dude 90% of all players were using in that era, bonds became the best because he already was the best- Barry Bonds is the greatest baseball player of any generation regardless of steroids, you've never played the game if you don't get that. Barry Bonds is baseballs g.o.a.t, hank 2nd, babe 3rd hands down- ask anyone who faced Bonds. mark McGwire was a known user and no one feared him like they feared bonds, look at the numbers dude and McGwire was the closest thing to bonds as a power threat in that era next to Sammy.
The only argument you have with PEDs (steroids) is just that... performance enhancing. Think about it. People on here talk about monitors, input lag, response time, and all that stuff all the time, but you still have to put the PCI in the right spot.
You’re right in saying steroids didn’t help his hand-eye coordination, or see the pitches easier. But if you’re developing explosive muscle through the use of that junk, it’s definitely going to help your bat and hands get through the zone with higher velocity.
Bonds was several levels higher than any other steroid user in that era, no ones numbers come close minus a-rod and Pujols but even they were a few steps under Bonds. Pitchers throwing at Bonds were using-not all but more than 75% and he made 'em all look stupid way more than any other player of that era. Bonds stood above players before steroids, he stood even higher above with steroids against competition that was using it against him- Bonds is baseballs g.o.a.t. hands down- hank is second(how many know or realize Hank Aaron has the 3rd most hits of any player in mlb)
Here here!!! Cheers to you sir!!! Have a drink on me buddy!! Thank you for saying that!!!
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@dingers4days14 said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@Buck_Mango said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
https://www.si.com/mlb/2020/01/23/sign-stealing-history-astros-red-sox
if you aint cheating you aint trying, cheating has been going on in sports since the inception of sports just sometimes people get caught. had they admitted to it, no worries water under the bridge.
It really must suck to be an Astros fan knowing that you barely won one title by cheating when the Giants won 3 in 5 years w/o cheating lmao.
That’s hilarious!
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@wingo18 said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@Buck_Mango said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@NCStateHokie said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@Buck_Mango said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@dbarmonstar said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@Buck_Mango said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@dbarmonstar said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@Buck_Mango said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
https://www.si.com/mlb/2020/01/23/sign-stealing-history-astros-red-sox
if you aint cheating you aint trying, cheating has been going on in sports since the inception of sports just sometimes people get caught. had they admitted to it, no worries water under the bridge.
Difference with the Astros it was a whole team. in the past at least it has been players majority of the time, Even the Black sox scandal was not the whole team just some players. They got severely punished. the issue here is players got away with the cheating and the team still keeps the title. The way Manfred handled this is the real problem. The way the Astros players are acting this year is disrespectful.
they just got caught, this didn't end all cheating- deep down a lot of people are thinking "dang why didn't we think of that"- I loathe the Astros, they've always been overly arrogant s.o.b.'s in my opinion, I'm just pointing out truth now we know why they were "overly arrogant"
Yeah they did get caught and what was done, nothing nothing at all to the players. That is the real problem, No one is saying others are not cheating, do not use that as an excuse that others did not get caught so it was ok for the Astros players to get away with it. Manfred is a tool. If this is how Manfred wants to be then Pete Rose should be re instated and Joe Jackson should be in the hall of fame if cheating does not matter cause everyone does it mentality.
when I was a little leaguer back in '83 I listed Pete Rose as my favorite baseball player, I hear ya- too much hypocrisy period. Barry Bonds was hands down the greatest player to play the game, he could recognize a pitch before it left the pitchers hand- steroids didn't help him do that, steroids didn't give bonds "super eyes", he truly is a Giant. Roger Clemens just did what everyone else was doing at the time and kept doing what he did shutting them down. Sometimes in your mind you're like " well [censored] if they're doing it and not getting busted and its making those scrubs better I may as well do it too, I aint a snitch and I know if its making your scrub zzz better I'm dominating". Bonds and Clemens are first ballot, Bonds was a [censored] to the media, tell me how steroids helped him finish with an on base percentage over .500 for 4 straight years- between the ages of 36-39 when most couldn't remember their prime, steroids didn't do that the greatest eye in baseball did that.
I know you're a troll so this is the only thing I'll say about this but I'm guessing you accidentally left out the part where steroids help you bulk up. While he certainly had a great eye (and I agree that steroids had very little to do with that) when you have arms the size of most grown men's thighs then your bat speed and power just might get a little boost. I remember he got walked with the bases loaded a time or two. Pitchers/managers walked him so much on purpose because of the sheer power that man had. Steroids most definitely provide an advantage to those that take them.
In 2004 he had an other worldly .609 OBP. He was walked 232 times, 120 of those intentionally and I bet quite a few of the other 112 were intentionally unintentional.
so he was the strongest dude that ever lived, that's your argument basically, being the strongest dude ever with the greatest eye means you should be in the hall. Bonds was the best player before steroids(https://www.baseball-reference.com/players/b/bondsba01.shtml) he became the best steroid user then- dude 90% of all players were using in that era, bonds became the best because he already was the best- Barry Bonds is the greatest baseball player of any generation regardless of steroids, you've never played the game if you don't get that. Barry Bonds is baseballs g.o.a.t, hank 2nd, babe 3rd hands down- ask anyone who faced Bonds. mark McGwire was a known user and no one feared him like they feared bonds, look at the numbers dude and McGwire was the closest thing to bonds as a power threat in that era next to Sammy.
The only argument you have with PEDs (steroids) is just that... performance enhancing. Think about it. People on here talk about monitors, input lag, response time, and all that stuff all the time, but you still have to put the PCI in the right spot.
You’re right in saying steroids didn’t help his hand-eye coordination, or see the pitches easier. But if you’re developing explosive muscle through the use of that junk, it’s definitely going to help your bat and hands get through the zone with higher velocity.
I agree with this, except the pitchers were on it too. Everybody is entitled to his own opinion, and in my opinion Bonds gets a pass. Mostly, cuz the owners all knew and turned a blind eye to it (to “save” baseball) then wanted to blame the players. That’s BS! I don’t put one single asterisk on the steroid era cuz the owners were in on it.
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Astros are a total disgrace.
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This thread is ONE THING: DEPRESSING
Edit: Ok two. It is also hilarious -
@Buck_Mango said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@dbarmonstar said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@Buck_Mango said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@dbarmonstar said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@Buck_Mango said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
https://www.si.com/mlb/2020/01/23/sign-stealing-history-astros-red-sox
if you aint cheating you aint trying, cheating has been going on in sports since the inception of sports just sometimes people get caught. had they admitted to it, no worries water under the bridge.
Difference with the Astros it was a whole team. in the past at least it has been players majority of the time, Even the Black sox scandal was not the whole team just some players. They got severely punished. the issue here is players got away with the cheating and the team still keeps the title. The way Manfred handled this is the real problem. The way the Astros players are acting this year is disrespectful.
they just got caught, this didn't end all cheating- deep down a lot of people are thinking "dang why didn't we think of that"- I loathe the Astros, they've always been overly arrogant s.o.b.'s in my opinion, I'm just pointing out truth now we know why they were "overly arrogant"
Yeah they did get caught and what was done, nothing nothing at all to the players. That is the real problem, No one is saying others are not cheating, do not use that as an excuse that others did not get caught so it was ok for the Astros players to get away with it. Manfred is a tool. If this is how Manfred wants to be then Pete Rose should be re instated and Joe Jackson should be in the hall of fame if cheating does not matter cause everyone does it mentality.
when I was a little leaguer back in '83 I listed Pete Rose as my favorite baseball player, I hear ya- too much hypocrisy period. Barry Bonds was hands down the greatest player to play the game, he could recognize a pitch before it left the pitchers hand- steroids didn't help him do that, steroids didn't give bonds "super eyes", he truly is a Giant. Roger Clemens just did what everyone else was doing at the time and kept doing what he did shutting them down. Sometimes in your mind you're like " well [censored] if they're doing it and not getting busted and its making those scrubs better I may as well do it too, I aint a snitch and I know if its making your scrub zzz better I'm dominating". Bonds and Clemens are first ballot, Bonds was a [censored] to the media, tell me how steroids helped him finish with an on base percentage over .500 for 4 straight years- between the ages of 36-39 when most couldn't remember their prime, steroids didn't do that the greatest eye in baseball did that.
No disrespect, but you're a fool.
Steroids absolutely helped Bonds. Just because you have "super eyes," doesn't mean you're gonna hit it out of the ballpark which Bonds was known for. Steroids make muscles bigger and bones stronger, which enhances your ability to hit for power which I'm pretty sure attributed to his ability to hit it out of the ballpark everytime he stepped to the plate. To my point, Tony Gwynn, Rod Carew, and so many others could have been considered to have "super eyes," but were never considered as a threat to hit a homerun.
Additionally, Bonds on base percentage of over .500 probably also had something to do with the fact that he is the all-time leader in both walks and intentional walks and by an insurmountable margin. This could link back to the fact that he was a homerun threat, which could link back to the fact that he took steroids, and not "super eyes."
The fact that you would ever label Bonds and Clemens as "scrubs" validates your foolishness.
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Well according to Tom in the video there, the people who got caught were banned from baseball, the Astros only got fined 5 million dollars and no player served a suspension.
How can you not be upset about that? -
@raesONE said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@dbarmonstar said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@pbake12 said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@Gbobnick said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@pbake12 said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@Gbobnick said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
You get caught you get crucified.
The 1951 Giants also cheated with a sign stealing scheme at Polo Grounds.
And?
So if they are not caught until much later they didn’t do anything wrong? My point aligns with the OP, most sports fans cheer for a team that has cheated, no need to crucify past the punishment they received.
That is the issues no punishment was received for he players
They were awarded immunity for cooperation. That's the only way the truth would come to light, and that's what happened. Major League Baseball just wanted to learn their scheme to prevent it from happening again, they were looking bigger picture.
This somehow is always ignored. I am a dodger fan and have every right to be upset as anyone else. But, we would never have known what happened if the players didn’t get immunity. So, what other option did the commissioner have?
Now, do I wish that Correa and the owner had just owned up to it and admitted that they had an unfair advantage? Yes. I think this whole thing would be viewed differently. It seems altuve didn’t like it, but he didn’t say anything. If I recall Bergman was a rookie, so he’s in a bad spot. The gm and coaches are in charge. So, they take the punishment. I think we can all agree the rest of the Astros will get their punishment with public opinion and lost pay. The only one to get off skate free was Gonzalez who already got his pay day.
I believe that these guys thought/assumed everyone else was doing something like it. I think Beltran and Cora May have even believed it themselves.
Do I wish the dodgers had a fair shot at winning it? Yes.
Did the Astros get a fair punishment, in my opinion? Yes
There are lines and the Astros crossed one.
Apologies if this point was already brought up. I only have read up to this post.
My opinions are my own and subject to change on convincing argument.
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@mjfc_363 said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@NCStateHokie said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@Buck_Mango said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@dbarmonstar said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@Buck_Mango said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@dbarmonstar said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
@Buck_Mango said in For everyone crucifying the Astros, learn some baseball history:
https://www.si.com/mlb/2020/01/23/sign-stealing-history-astros-red-sox
if you aint cheating you aint trying, cheating has been going on in sports since the inception of sports just sometimes people get caught. had they admitted to it, no worries water under the bridge.
Difference with the Astros it was a whole team. in the past at least it has been players majority of the time, Even the Black sox scandal was not the whole team just some players. They got severely punished. the issue here is players got away with the cheating and the team still keeps the title. The way Manfred handled this is the real problem. The way the Astros players are acting this year is disrespectful.
they just got caught, this didn't end all cheating- deep down a lot of people are thinking "dang why didn't we think of that"- I loathe the Astros, they've always been overly arrogant s.o.b.'s in my opinion, I'm just pointing out truth now we know why they were "overly arrogant"
Yeah they did get caught and what was done, nothing nothing at all to the players. That is the real problem, No one is saying others are not cheating, do not use that as an excuse that others did not get caught so it was ok for the Astros players to get away with it. Manfred is a tool. If this is how Manfred wants to be then Pete Rose should be re instated and Joe Jackson should be in the hall of fame if cheating does not matter cause everyone does it mentality.
when I was a little leaguer back in '83 I listed Pete Rose as my favorite baseball player, I hear ya- too much hypocrisy period. Barry Bonds was hands down the greatest player to play the game, he could recognize a pitch before it left the pitchers hand- steroids didn't help him do that, steroids didn't give bonds "super eyes", he truly is a Giant. Roger Clemens just did what everyone else was doing at the time and kept doing what he did shutting them down. Sometimes in your mind you're like " well [censored] if they're doing it and not getting busted and its making those scrubs better I may as well do it too, I aint a snitch and I know if its making your scrub zzz better I'm dominating". Bonds and Clemens are first ballot, Bonds was a [censored] to the media, tell me how steroids helped him finish with an on base percentage over .500 for 4 straight years- between the ages of 36-39 when most couldn't remember their prime, steroids didn't do that the greatest eye in baseball did that.
I know you're a troll so this is the only thing I'll say about this but I'm guessing you accidentally left out the part where steroids help you bulk up. While he certainly had a great eye (and I agree that steroids had very little to do with that) when you have arms the size of most grown men's thighs then your bat speed and power just might get a little boost. I remember he got walked with the bases loaded a time or two. Pitchers/managers walked him so much on purpose because of the sheer power that man had. Steroids most definitely provide an advantage to those that take them.
In 2004 he had an other worldly .609 OBP. He was walked 232 times, 120 of those intentionally and I bet quite a few of the other 112 were intentionally unintentional.
Barry got some help from the juice there’s no doubt. The main area he got help in was the ability to recover and stay healthy. Did it make him stronger, sure it did. But you’re still hitting a round ball, with a round bat, coming at you at 100mph. Hardest thing to do in professional sports. Barry was a world class hitter before the juice. I DO NOT for one second believe his increase in strength was the reason he hit more bombs. I believe it was a combination of Barry’s next level patience, and his next level skill. Neither of which any player in the league possess today. He might.....I repeat might, see one pitch to hit per game and for about a 4 year run, he never missed.......or very rarely! We will NEVER see that type of skill and production ever again!!! The Astros couldn’t hit like Barry and they cheated!!
I agree with everything you said but the bolded part. I just don't understand how someone who understands baseball can say that being stronger doesn't affect bat speed and how far somebody hits a ball. Of course there are lots of things that come together to make a successful hitter and strength/power/bat speed are certainly some of them.
